Jesus’ “Potential”?

An excellent video exposing the shortcomings of the Christian concept of “God”, and how Christians struggle to explain it:

 

Thanks to brother Tony for the video.

153 thoughts on “Jesus’ “Potential”?

    1. stewjo004

      @ Joel
      I’m sorry I’m just trying to see where you’re coming from are you saying that you don’t think the scholar and an idiot should both be able to understand God? The whole point of God sending revelation is for Him to reveal who He is, our relationship to Him and what He wants from us. If you cannot explain at a basic fundamental level who God is I believe that is a real problem and is not a laughing matter.

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      1. Joel

        I saw nothing in the video to suggest the good Christian woman was having any trouble explaining the christian concept of god.

        What you are avoiding is the arrogant presumption in islam that allah can be explained – god (the true god) is by definition beyond human comprehension and, thus, beyond explanation.

        You have dishonestly moved the goalposts – a tactic which seems to be something islam imparts to its adherents. Christians know perfectly well who god is, what he wants from us, and how he wants us to live. Muslims cannot agree if allah wants muslims to have sex with 9 year olds, or grown women, or whether he wants you to murder disbelievers or oppress them.

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    2. hey joel, when i die , i will be one person. how is my one person (minus flesh) different from the fathers one person ?

      the fathers oneness is no different that my oneness, this means i and the fathers person is like created person.

      without looking at the BEING and other persons of “triune being,” explain how the fathers PERSON is different than my one person ?

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      1. Joel

        roger/tony/sybill

        So, are you going to finally explain how allah’s oneness is different to rabbit’s? Or any creature’s?

        LOL!! And you guys think you can “explain” your imposter “god”.

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      2. joel, we all know that deep down in your pagan christian heart, u know that you are a polytheist who sees your “one being” as DIFFERING beings which make up your pagan triune being . when you say “one” what you mean is 3 beings which are DIFFERING beings , each is not triune being . your mind NEEDS to imagine 3 beings.

        i will explain

        father IS “god”

        this would mean father is A being

        how is the fathers person AND being different than a donkeys, goats, humans, being ?

        how is the fathers person different than a dogs person when the dog loses its body?

        joel , you think we will be fooled with your WRAPPING of “one” around 3 BEINGS ?

        you think we will be fooled when you try to have your “one” transform the 3 beings into one thing?

        we will never be fooled you idolatrous kafir.

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      3. Joel

        roger/tony/sybill

        You are dumb.

        Are going to explain allah’s oneness or not? If not why not? Is it too hard for muslims to explain their “god”?

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      4. Paulus

        I think roger/tony/intellect whatever his name is has so many false troll accounts he forgets to close them down as he comments

        I think he needs a hobby or something…

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  1. Walter

    “The 3 persons in eternity past points to “relationship”. God is relationship; God is personal; God is living. God is one in substance, nature, essence – One God; but 3 in relationship, persons.”

    Found this while taking a stroll on Ken’s blog today, so “His” oneness is not so unique after all if God is relationship. What do you guys think?

    Liked by 1 person

    1. “Found this while taking a stroll on Ken’s blog today, so “His” oneness is not so unique after all if God is relationship. What do you guys think?”

      its a limited relationship since the JEALOUS father don’t like to cause/beget a holy spirit which can cause /beget OTHER beings/persons.

      Liked by 1 person

      1. Walter

        Yeah It’s kinda like a team, a family to be more accurate cogitating that they share the essence, like a family involves different relationships at it’s interior and in that particular case it seems the family or the team is what is called “god” and it consists of 3 different self aware/conscious members who share some kind of relationship…nothing unique or “beyond human comprehension” as far as i can see, it’s just how we define the word “God” itself…

        reminds me of hymn that always makes me chuckle, i still know it by heart, the last part is…

        Holy Father, holy Son, Holy Spirit~
        Three we name you~
        Though in essence only one~
        Undivided God we claim you~
        Then, adoring, bend the knee~
        And confess the mystery.

        mother of Jesus, It’s like “no this is not polytheism but it is polytheism my old mate though it’s not polytheism”…if i insist that an apple is an orange, it doesn’t really make it an orange at all…

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  2. Honestly, I didn’t even get four minutes into the video. This Muslim has no respect. Lizzie sits and waits for him to go on and on, and then when she starts to give a rebuttal, he is making comments throughout, and then interrupting and not even letting her finish after about thirty seconds. This is not a debate. It is a browbeating. No respect at all.

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    1. Paulus

      It’s the perception that matters for Muslims. Irrespective of what is being said Muslims have to “look” like they are superior. Otherwise they bring shame to Allah and the deen. It’s just another reflection of external works based religion.

      And imagine being humiliated by a woman! Lizzie makes a fool of these guys all the time. It’s hilarious!

      At least Paul Williams is respectful- not because of Islam, but because of his Christian and western heritage.

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  3. “The 3 persons in eternity past points to “relationship”. God is relationship; God is personal; God is living. God is one in substance, nature, essence – One God; but 3 in relationship, persons.”

    yes, 3 ones, 3 separate beings, 3 lovers….

    there “one” is simply AN ingredient / “make up” /

    like

    chair is PLASTIC
    bottle is plastic
    doll is plastic

    see? just an INGREDIENT . they know deep down they worship 3 differing pagan gods who make love to each other.

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    1. stewjo004

      @ Joel
      Sorry, I saw your other post. To begin oneness is not “anthropomorphism”. Anthropomorphism is giving human qualities to non-human things, for example, in Looney Toons, Bugs Bunny is a talking rabbit when obviously rabbits don’t talk. Being “One” is not a human characteristic. However regarding God’s attributes of Al Wahid (The One) and Al Ahad (The Unique One) yes even these qualities are unique to Him. God says in His Scripture:

      “I’ve created everything in pairs to complement one another, so that perhaps you might think and remember.” (51:49)

      Ibn Abbas(ra) a “disciple” of Prophet Muhammad(saw) said the “that perhaps you might think and remember” part of this verse is God showing He has no opposite. For example, Light and Darkness, Tall and Short, Heaven and Earth, Sun and Moon, Good and Evil, Male and Female, etc.

      There is no opposite pair to God. He is One and there is nothing that is His opposite or equal. With rabbits, there are millions of rabbits on this planet. With humans, there are billions of humans. Even you and I are not truly one. For example, many people think I look like the hip-hop artist Drake. Someone somewhere at sometime has our personality traits (usually your parents or children). God’s “Oneness” goes beyond a number. There is nothing like Him and He is the Only true God. He has never or will never have another “One” alongside Him.

      Liked by 1 person

      1. Joel

        stew

        To begin oneness is not “anthropomorphism”.

        Never said it was, but it is an attribute shared by creatures.

        “I’ve created everything in pairs to complement one another, so that perhaps you might think and remember.” (51:49)

        LOL!! Proof that the quran was written by an ignorant nomad and not by some omniscient entity. Bacteria don’t come in pairs, the quran is wrong and not the word of god, ergo.

        Ibn Abbas(ra) a “disciple” of Prophet Muhammad(saw) said the “that perhaps you might think and remember” part of this verse is God showing He has no opposite. For example, Light and Darkness, Tall and Short, Heaven and Earth, Sun and Moon, Good and Evil, Male and Female, etc.

        LOL!! This is proof that mohammed was ignorant. The sun and moon are opposites? How so? Heaven and earth are opposites? How so? They clearly are not.

        There is no opposite pair to God. He is One and there is nothing that is His opposite or equal.

        AGREED! There is nothing in the universe like the triune God, everything in creation is one like allah.

        With rabbits, there are millions of rabbits on this planet. With humans, there are billions of humans. Even you and I are not truly one. For example, many people think I look like the hip-hop artist Drake. Someone somewhere at sometime has our personality traits (usually your parents or children). God’s “Oneness” goes beyond a number. There is nothing like Him and He is the Only true God. He has never or will never have another “One” alongside Him.

        Again, islamic thinking has you resorting to logical fallacies. You are basically saying that alla is one because he is one – this is circular and explains nothing.

        As for you looking like Drake – you betray the simplistic thinking of islamic apologetics – if they cloned Drake thet would end up with drake, just like if they cloned mohammed they would end up with mohammed, NOT Katie hopkins. So your argument fails because all creatures are truly one- our genetic material will produce only us not someone or something else.

        Try again, explain allah’s oneness without resorting to circularity.

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      2. “LOL!! Proof that the quran was written by an ignorant nomad and not by some omniscient entity. Bacteria don’t come in pairs, the quran is wrong and not the word of god, ergo.”

        LOL!! Proof that Coco has no clue what he is talking about! How will you pretend to actually know anything about science? If you want examples of true ignorance, you need not look further than the Bible, but we’ll get to that.

        The verse about “pairs” actually DOES apply to bacteria. If you knew anything about biology, you would know that bacteria exchange genes with each other in process of sexual reproduction called “conjugation”.

        So, once again, Coco has been exposed as a charlatan who is ignorant of scientific concepts.

        Now, let us get to the evidence that the Bible was written by ignorant people like Coco:

        ““The rabbit, though it chews the cud, does not have a divided hoof; it is unclean for you.”” (Lev. 11:6)

        Rabbits chew “cud”, according to the Bible. This means they are “ruminants” like cows. The only problem is that…rabbits are NOT ruminants. They DON’T “chew the cud”. They are in fact monogastric herbivores, which means they are not ruminants. Rumination requires a mult-chambered stomach, as in cows. But rabbits only have a one-chambered stomach (hence the term “monogastric”). The Bible is wrong and therefore cannot be the “inspired” word of God, ergo.

        For more examples of scientific errors in the Bible, read my article: https://quranandbibleblog.wordpress.com/2014/03/08/science-in-the-bible-and-the-quran/

        “LOL!! This is proof that mohammed was ignorant. The sun and moon are opposites? How so? Heaven and earth are opposites? How so? They clearly are not.”

        LOL!! This is proof that Coco is clueless about his own Bible! Genesis describes the creation of the sun and the moon as “lights” in the sky:

        “God made two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night.”

        See? They are “pairs”. Of course, people with knowledge of astronomy, which the Biblical author did not have, know that the moon is not a “light” like the sun. Rather, the moon reflects the sun’s light. Ergo, it is wrong for the Bible to describe the moon as a “light”.

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      1. stewjo004

        My apologies Joel I misunderstood when you said”I saw nothing in the video to suggest the good Christian woman was having any trouble explaining the christian concept of god.” as meaning the Trinity was easy and logical. Looking back I see you don’t believe it’s easy to understand and for that again I’m sorry for misunderstanding your point and saying what you don’t believe.

        As for the image from Wikipedia (admittedly a lazy reference):
        “The Shield of the Trinity or Scutum Fidei (Latin for “shield of faith”) is a traditional Christian visual symbol which expresses many aspects of the doctrine of the Trinity, summarizing the first part of the Athanasian Creed in a compact diagram.”

        So seeing the Trinity concept in a visual diagram do you believe this is logical?

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  4. hey joel, notice how the crosstian in the video say that the persons/beings in the trinity are “super glued” to each other LOL and then he gave the body, soul …as an example. lol
    this means that jebus is joint to the hip of the father like your body is composite. so can you explain, how is the BEING of yhwh different than a human being …

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    1. this is a funny one

      x = 100% god
      y = 100% god
      z= 100% god

      the reality should be 300 %

      but the crosstian MERGES all the three together making the x into y and z = “100%”

      either they over lap EACH PAGAN person and KEEP the distinction or they LIE and cut out differences by having them all act like they are 1 person which is split into three persons.

      it is easy to catch out trinitarian crap when one keeps on studying their crapstian way of thinking .

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      1. stewjo004

        @ Paulus
        Excellent question and the thing we should really be discussing. All the other stuff is just noise to the heart of the issue.

        Tawheed- True monotheism. The literal definition is when something is smashed and put back together. For example, a pot that is broken and glued back together. Shirk is the antithesis. For easy reference, I will post a Quran verse containing Tawheed and a Bible verse that contains shirk.

        Tawheed branches off into 3 categories. Unity in God’s:

        1. Lordship
        Islam rejects any dualistic views such as a “god of good” or a “god of evil”. God is in control of all things at all times and nothing happens unless He allows it including evil. Even though He doesn’t directly ascribe evil unto Himself He allows it for the good that it will ultimately bring. Commonly (even though in fairness the Bible doesn’t say this) you’ll hear Christians think the Devil is the ruler of Hell and punishes souls etc. The reality is the Devil will be punished in Hell and God is the one who controls it.

        Tawheed verse:
        …When good comes, they say: “This is from God!” and when bad comes they say: “This is all your fault, this is from you!” Tell them: “It’s all from God.” So what’s wrong with these people that they fail to understand any words they’re told? (4:78)
        Say: “I surrender myself to the protection of the Lord of the daybreak. From the evil of what He’s created,” (113:1-2)

        Shirk verse:
        Satan, who is the god of this world, has blinded the minds of those who don’t believe. They are unable to see the glorious light of the Good News. They don’t understand this message about the glory of Christ, who is the exact likeness of God. (2 Corinthians 4:4)

        2. Name and attributes
        God is only described using things He or the Messenger(saw) have described Him as. One cannot give God creation’s attributes or give God attributes of creation.

        Tawheed verse:
        Call Him God or the Most Merciful. Whatever you call Him know the best and most beautiful names belong to Him. (17:110)
        “And there is nothing that can be compared to Him…” (112:4)

        Shirk verse:
        And the LORD regretted that He had made man on the earth, and it grieved Him in His heart. (Genesis 6:6)
        And the LORD repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people. (Exodus 32:14)
        “I (God) regret that I have made Saul king, for he has turned back from following me and has not performed my commandments.” And Samuel was angry, and he cried to the LORD all night. 1 Samuel 15:11)
        This Melchizedek was king of Salem and priest of God Most High. He met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings and blessed him…Without father or mother or genealogy, without beginning of days or end of life, like the Son of God, he remains a priest for all time. (Hebrew 7:1-3)

        3. Worship
        Prayers and worship are God’s alone. You cannot direct these actions to a man, angel, saint, etc. Where people also commonly make a mistake in this is in regards to love. You have to love God above all things. What is the proof someone does this? When for example, your wife or children want you to do something other than what God has ordered if you choose them not to upset them ultimately you love them more than God.

        Tawheed verse:
        And yet there are some people who equate others with Him. They love them as they should love God. But know those who believe are stronger in their love for God… (2:165)

        I’ve never sent any Messenger before…without revealing to him: “There is no god but Me, so only worship Me.” (21:5)

        Oh you who believe! Give from what I have given to you before a Day comes when there will be no trading, no friendship and no intercession. It’s the disbelievers who are doing wrong. God, there is no god but He, The Ever Living source of Life. The Caretaker of existence. Neither tireness nor sleep overcomes Him. Whatever and whoever is in the heavens and earth belongs to Him. So who is this that can mediate with Him except by His allowance? He knows what lies before them and what will be after them. While they can’t encompass a thing of His knowledge except for what He wishes to reveal. His pedestal extends over and encompass the heavens and the earth, and He feels no fatigue in guarding and looking after them. He alone is the Most High and Strong. (2:254-255)

        That is God, your Lord, there is no god but Him. The Creator of everything, so worship only Him because He is taking care of all things. (6:102)

        Shirk verse:
        “Paul. . . to the church of God in Corinth, to those sanctified in Christ Jesus and called to be holy, together with all those everywhere who call on the name of our Lord Jesus Christ—their Lord and ours (1 Corinthians 1:1–2).”

        Now may our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God our Father, who loved us and gave us eternal comfort and good hope through grace, 17 comfort your hearts and establish them in every good work and word. (2 Thessalonians 2:16–17)

        Tawheed is what the prophets taught and called towards. Even though the brothers get annoyyed and insult when they shouldn’t deep down everyone here is calling you, Joel and Robert to Tawheed. All you gotta do is accept it and come onto the path of Abraham(as).

        They claim: “Be Jews or Christians and you will be guided.” Tell them: “Never! We follow the religion of Abraham. The one who was solely dedicated toward the Truth, and he was never someone who equated others with God.” (2:135)

        Liked by 1 person

      2. Paulus

        Great, a triune definition 😜! Now can you discuss tawheed without committing shirk yourself?

        Question- how is Allah’s oneness unlike any other oneness?

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      3. paulus, how many consciousnesses does the father have ?

        33 % or 100 % ? if you stretch 100 % consciousness ACROSS all three, how does the father even know there is a son ?

        think about it.

        if i took your concsciousness, your dogs consciousness and your dads consciousness, and stretched the fathers consciousness over all 3 items, now it has ALL been TRANSFORMED to “one consciousness”
        so how will you be aware of your dog or your father ?

        and when the father is sent down, isn’t that one consciousness being sent down too ?

        Liked by 1 person

      4. paulus man, HOW much CONSCIOUSNESS does the father have ?

        33% or 100 %

        if all 3 are UNDER one consciousness, how is it we don’t have 1 PERSON one being here?

        how many consciousnesses are you paulus ? how many being are u paulus ?

        if the triune being is ONE consciousness, how is its BEING and consciousness not different than my oneness?

        so answer,does the father have 100 % consciousness ?

        does the triune being have ONE CONSCIOUSNESS ?

        haha

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      5. paulus, where did you go? is the father a REAL self paulus ? is he aware he has a child ? is the son aware of his dad ? when they make love, are they aware of each other ? 2 lovers ? how many consciousnesses ? so if each is a consciousness by itself, do we have here TRI-THEISM ? so is each person is ONE in the sense a dog, cat, goat, human is one? how many is ONE person , paulus ?

        so is there ONE CONSCIOUSNESS

        or MULTIPLE. if multiple, is each a UNITARIAN person ? hahaha

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  5. stewjo004

    @ Paulus
    I answered that question back when Joel asked just stay on the page, ctrl+F Ahad. So, Paulus, did you agree with everything I said in regards to Tawheed or no? If not why?

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Paulus

      Nonsense.

      You basically said Allah is one because he is one. That’s not an explanation. Even then “oneness” is a earthly description or attribute. Ergo, shirk.

      How is allah unlike anything else?

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      1. stewjo004

        I have no idea what you or Joel read I never said God is One because He is One. He is One because there is no equal or opposite to Him.

        Liked by 1 person

      2. hey kafir,

        You basically said Allah is one because he is one. That’s not an explanation. Even then “oneness” is a earthly description or attribute.”

        tell me how the ONE DIVINE being in trinity is DIFFERENT than a donkey, sheep, goat, do NOT, i repeat, do not BRING in your who’s . i want you to tell me how the ONE “divine BEING” is different that my ONE HUMAN being .

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      3. your WHO IS NOT YOUR WHAT. your what IS DIFFERENT THAN ur who.

        so tell me how is your ONE WHAT different than my HUMAN being/one what

        and tell me, HOW MANY CONSCIOUSNESSES ARE THERE IN YOUR god .

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  6. “AGREED! There is nothing in the universe like the triune God, everything in creation is one like allah.”

    hey pig, when i die, i will be one invisible PERson, HOW IS my person different than the fathers person ?
    tell me about the “one” in “one person” ?

    since yhwh is TRIUNE being and father is A being, then how is the fathers BEING , different than my HUMAN being which is one ?

    the logos is no different that one dog, one sheep, one pig, one ball in sack, one anything . composite one.

    Liked by 1 person

  7. stewjo004

    @ Joel

    I’m going to make the excuse that you skimmed what I wrote because some of your response is strange to see the least:

    If you weren’t much in a hurry to insult you would realize the sun and moon or heavens and earth was me Stew talking not the Prophet(saw) or the Qur’an hence me saying “for example”. My point of making the comparisons between the two besides the fact that people normally pair them together, the sun is the most prominent thing in the day while the moon is the most prominent at night. The earth and the sky (i.e. the heavens) are generally considered opposites by most people like are we really going to argue all these things are not normally paired together in poetic thought?

    Next, bacteria reproduces and splits creating its pair. If you really want to start getting into it an antibody would be bacterias opposite as well. Please stop with the childishness arguments and pay attention to what I m saying. (rolls eyes)

    Next, you said something incorrect Hinduism has a trinity as well:
    https://sites.google.com/a/pleasantonusd.net/hindu-gods/hindu-trinity

    Moving on, I did not use any “logical fallacy” (no idea where you got that from) God’s names are Al Ahad and Al Wahid and you asked what the explanation to the names mean. He is “One” not only in number (which is what you assumed) but because He has no other thing to be His opposite or equal. He is alone by Himself as the One True God with nothing to be compared to. There can never be another God that was in existence with God. For example, because Jesus was born and “died” he is a lesser deity to God who is eternal and cannot die. Jesus(as) is recorded in your text as not knowing the Hour while God does meaning Jesus(as) is not All-Knowing. Jesus says God is his god showing a subservient position. There were plenty of things not unique to Jesus(as) from miracles, to a god becoming human (all throughout Roman/Greek thought). Even him “dying” and being resurrected appears in multiple mythological stories.

    You Joel are not entirely unique or one. There are hundreds of thousands of people named Joel, there are millions of European men, there are millions of whatever profession you are etc. There is NOTHING like God hence Him being THEE One and Unique One. If you insist that the Triune god is unique when Jesus was born God created a “copy” of Himself walking around thus taking away His unique status as He created another who was equal to Him (as per trinitarian thought).The Triune god is so ununique there are 3 of it.

    Next, a clone is NOT the same as the original. And instead of using childish arguments that you clearly don’t understand, its actually an ethical discussion in cloning. Even if the clone had the same memories, etc it becomes a new person with a new soul. They would “diverge” from their origin the moment they were “born” and develop their own opinions, feelings etc. it would not become just like a 2nd Drake walking aroundetc. But that clone is still not entirely unique or truly “one of a kind” because of the points listed above

    God is my and your Lord. He does not have children nor was born. Why would you worship something that was subservient to something stronger than it?

    Liked by 1 person

    1. “Next, bacteria reproduces and splits creating its pair. If you really want to start getting into it an antibody would be bacterias opposite as well. Please stop with the childishness arguments and pay attention to what I m saying. (rolls eyes)”

      LOL, yes Coco is a silly little monkey isn’t he? By the way, what you describe above is called binary fission. This is a form of asexual reproduction in bacteria.

      Like

    2. Paulus

      This is bad. The only way your argument works is to (falsely) attribute polytheism to others.

      Please try again.

      Explain how allahs oneness is unlike anything else.

      Like

    3. Joel

      stew

      LOL!!

      Next, a clone is NOT the same as the original. And instead of using childish arguments that you clearly don’t understand, its actually an ethical discussion in cloning. Even if the clone had the same memories, etc it becomes a new person with a new soul.

      Did you actually think before you wrote this nonsense? You have just affirmed my point without even getting it – if even a clone is unique compared to its donor DNA, then all creatures are unique and different and cannot be said to be the same. You can;t make this stuff up. LOL!!

      There are hundreds of thousands of people named Joel, there are millions of European men, there are millions of whatever profession you are etc. There is NOTHING like God hence Him being THEE One and Unique One.

      You just admitted that each individual is uniquely different, please make up your mind what you want me to believe. And I cannot take you seriously when the best argument you can put forward is “god is one because he is one!!!!!”.

      That is circular reasoning, and a fallacy.

      Next, bacteria reproduces and splits creating its pair. If you really want to start getting into it an antibody would be bacterias opposite as well. Please stop with the childishness arguments and pay attention to what I m saying. (rolls eyes)

      Really? YOu don;t actually think before you post this stuff, do you? I though it was your “god”, allah, who created things in pairs, now you have moved the goalposts and argued that bacteria create themselves in pairs. I’m confused by islamic reasoning.

      And no, there is no hindu trinity in the same sense as the christian trinity – Yahweh is one being, the trimurti are three beings.

      Hope that clears it up.

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      1. “And no, there is no hindu trinity in the same sense as the christian trinity – Yahweh is one being, the trimurti are three beings.”

        crosstian pagan, you have no idea about the pagans religions around the pagan hebrews, do you ? don’t you know that the divine being could FRAGMENT and become beings WHICH were still the one being ? don’t you know that they thought that the PERSONS of these beings COULD mingle AND merge ?

        if you believe your “echad” then it is COMPOSITORY , JUST LIKE THE pagans believed that their “one ” is COMPOSITORY .

        http://podcast.foundjs.org/size/10/?search=sommer

        the thing is that the trinitarian “echad” just like the echad of the pagan gods is COMPLIMENTARY , not CONTRADICTORY. your “yhwh” just like their BEING is really the same stuff.

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      2. ” Yahweh is one being”

        Kafir, can you tell me HOW is yhwhs “being” different then my BEING which is ALSO one.

        “one being ”

        REMEMBER “one”

        tell me about this one WHAT, how is it different then the what of a DONKEY , ball bag, sheep, mouse, toilet , maggot …..

        Liked by 1 person

      3. “Really? YOu don;t actually think before you post this stuff, do you? I though it was your “god”, allah, who created things in pairs, now you have moved the goalposts and argued that bacteria create themselves in pairs. I’m confused by islamic reasoning.”

        Really? You don’t actually think before you post this stuff, do you? You tried to act like an expert, but then got humiliated upon finding out that bacteria do exist in pairs, whether via conjugation or binary fission. Here is the definition of conjugation:

        “Conjugation is a process of genetic recombination that occurs between two organisms (such as bacteria) in addition to asexual reproduction. Conjugation only occurs between cells of different mating types. In bacteria, cells designated F+ and F-lie close together, and a narrow bridge of cytoplasm forms between them.” (http://science.jrank.org/pages/6098/Sexual-Reproduction-Conjugation.html#ixzz5MrXmXd9s“)

        You see, ignoramus? Conjugation involves a…PAIR of bacteria that are of…DIFFERENT MATING TYPES! Ergo, they are a pair! God created them this way! Alhamdulillah! Give up your hatred of Islam, and shun your ignorant Bible! It will be for your OWN good!

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    1. Hey Tony, here we go again! Coco’s probably going to give us one of his heretical “analogies” to explain the trinity. Stew, we asked this question to Coco on BloggingtTheology, so you can most likely expect some sort of ridiculous analogy, like a three-leaf clover or something.

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      1. stewjo004

        @ Qb
        Correct me if I’m wrong but the three leaf clover analogy wouldn’t work because neither leaf is “distinct” from the other (i.e) there is no function of one from the other.

        In any case, the Bible completely goes against the Trinity if the three “are separate but equal” the Son cannot be subservient to the Father. There are clear cut vere where Jesus(as) says he is subservient to God for example please explain this passage in light of trinitarian theology:

        16“My teaching is NOT My own,” Jesus replied. “It comes from Him who SENT Me. 17If anyone desires to do His will, he will know whether MY teaching is from God OR whether I speak on My own. 18He who speaks on his own authority seeks his own glory, but He who seeks the glory of the One who sent Him is a man of truth; in Him there is no falsehood. (John 7:16-17)

        So God’s teaching is not God’s but is from God who sent God? If you desire to do God’s will you’ll know if God’s teaching (that is not His) is God’s if God speaks from God or if God is speaking from His own authority? If God speaks on His own He seeks His glory but if He seeks the glory of God who sent Him then there is no lie?

        Now, this is commentary I can’t wait for Joel, Paulus or Robe where yall at?

        Liked by 1 person

      2. Stew, yeah of course it is a bad analogy and that’s the point. Christians have struggled to logically explain the trinity for centuries and they have come up with all sorts of ridiculous “analogies” as a result. But they inevitably end up confirming a heretic understanding of the trinity. Coco tried that on BT by appealing to a nuclear fission/fusion analogy and by doing that, he exposed himself as just another pathetic Christian who pretends that the “trinity” can be explained. So whenever you see a Christian make such a claim, you can bet that he is lying through his teeth to keep up appearances.

        Like

      3. Paulus

        Stew the equality is of essence, not function vis-a-vis salvation.

        Creating straw man arguments Afghanistan Christianity doesn’t absolve you from explaining how Allah’s oneness is unlike anything else. Your argument of “non pairing” was refuted by yourself and your cloning discussion.

        So please try again. And try not to commit any more fallacies

        Like

    2. Joel

      stew

      No problem, the Lord is one being, three persons, one essence.
      Now, you explain how allah’s oneness is different to every created being’s without resorting to circularity.

      Like

      1. “No problem, the Lord is one being, three persons, one essence.”

        what kind of crap is this?

        “one being”

        HOW is your yhwhs WHAT DIFFERENT then my one what?

        how your yhwhs WHAT differen than a MAGGOTS what?

        how is the ONE person , DIFFERENT then my ONE person ?

        ONE ONE ONE ONE ONE.

        let me POUND u further

        is the consciousness of the father the SAME as the triune beings CONSCIOUSNESS?

        Like

      2. tell me HOW IS THE “one BEING” of yhwh DIFFERENT then the “ONE BEING ” OF A MAGGOT, BALL in sack, sheep, goat, testicle, squirrel , donkey ?

        Like


      3. No problem, the Lord is one being, three persons, one essence.”

        how much BEING is the father LOL ?

        “FATHER is god”

        so HOW much BEING is the father? is he “one being” like one ball in one sack ?

        Like

      4. stewjo004

        @ Joel
        Please stop listing a fallacy if you don’t know what it is because it makes you look silly. You’re weren’t reading my post which is why you’re saying something unrelated to it and why you thought the example I posted was from the Qur’an or the Prophet(saw). Circular reasoning would be this example:
        The Bible says the leader of Egypt during Joseph’s time was called a Pharaoh. The Qur’an calls him a king so therefore the Quran is wrong.

        Why is the Qur’an wrong? Because the Bible says a different thing than the Qur’an about Egyptian history. What we would do is look at Egyptian history at the time of Joseph to find out what the leader is called. The Hittites took over the northern end of Egypt during Joseph’s time. They had a foreign king and the Pharaohnic dynasty didn’t exist so therefore a new evidence is produced to show the Qur’an is right and the Bible is wrong.

        This situation of reaffirming an existing belief is NOT what happened. You skimmed my post and made an assumption about what I said hence why you only quoted that portion. God is One not just because of a numeric value but because He has no equal or opposite hence being one. His attributes are also uniquely His.

        Finally, you must’ve missed my question about the Trinity I’ll just repost for you

        “please explain this passage in light of trinitarian theology:

        16“My teaching is NOT My own,” Jesus replied. “It comes from Him who SENT Me. 17If anyone desires to do His will, he will know whether MY teaching is from God OR whether I speak on My own. 18He who speaks on his own authority seeks his own glory, but He who seeks the glory of the One who sent Him is a man of truth; in Him there is no falsehood. (John 7:16-17)

        So God’s teaching is not God’s but is from God who sent God? If you desire to do God’s will you’ll know if God’s teaching (that is not His) is God’s if God speaks from God or if God is speaking from His own authority? If God speaks on His own He seeks His glory but if He seeks the glory of God who sent Him then there is no lie?

        Now, this is commentary I can’t wait for Joel, Paulus or Robe where yall at?”

        Liked by 1 person

      5. Joel

        stew

        What on earth are you talking about? Don’t try to muddy the waters.

        This situation of reaffirming an existing belief is NOT what happened.

        You have just acknowledged that even when you take donor genetic material and clone a creature, that creature is not like the original – thus, you affirm my contention that the oneness of creatures is unique

        od is One not just because of a numeric value but because He has no equal or opposite hence being one. His attributes are also uniquely His.

        Just because you reword the same argument it doesn’t make it more valid. You ARE saying that allah is one because he is one, you just have not given it much thought because you are unquestioning in your faith. You have just repeated that allah is one because he is one and claimed that this is not what you are saying! LOL!!!

        Muslims still cannot explain allah’s oneness without referring to other attributes, nor can they explain how allah’s oneness is different to a goat’s.

        Also, what is satan’s opposite?

        please explain this passage in light of trinitarian theology:

        I’m not sure what point you are trying to make here. Please make a point and we an proceed. Also, explain how allah’s oneness is different to the oneness of god’s creations.

        Like

      6. “Muslims still cannot explain allah’s oneness without referring to other attributes, nor can they explain how allah’s oneness is different to a goat’s.”

        how is the fathers one PERSON differen than the one person of a goat ?
        how is the triune gods ONE being DIFFERENT than the ONE BEING of a maggot ?
        can u explain the “one” without MIXING ur whos and your whats ?

        Like

  8. “. Coco tried that on BT by appealing to a nuclear fission/fusion analogy and by doing that,”

    all “compository” .

    well, that day, she admitted that yhwhs oneness was like the suns created oneness.
    btw, does the colour pink next to her name indicate she is a she?

    Liked by 1 person

  9. “Stew the equality is of essence, not function….”

    every time the person is EXPERIENCING its function in its ONE person, it would have experiences the other persons would lack.

    but here is the main question .

    is the fathers CONSCIOUSNESS 100 % like the consciousness of the triune being ?

    Like

  10. joel/pig/brian/

    ///////////You can not accept that God is ONE being, who is three persons, the Father being ONE of those three persons. Each person( all though a separate person), is not a separate being//////////

    O dear o dear.
    If you look at just the Father alone then He is unitarian. You took all three of them and used the “three seats of consciousness” (whatever the hell that means) to justify your bs. I knew you would do that and the sad thing is, is that I even said that in my previous comment.

    You also go to ANOTHER attribute (consciousness) to say that the Father’s oneness is different from us.
    So if I said that Allah’s oneness is uncreated (which is another attribute) and therefore different from ours you would be ok with that right? Of course you wont cus that’s called being intellectually honest and crosstians don’t have that quality.

    ????
    Your pagan belief says that the trinity consists of three persons. The Father is one person, so is the Son and the HS. Being unitarian means to be ONE person. So yea the Father is ONE person.

    LOL! Teaching a xtian the basics of his religion.
    So how does HIS oneness differ from ours?

    I ask you how the Father’s oneness is different from ours and you go back to your multi personal rubbish. I am not talking about the trinity! I am just talking about one of its members: the Father. Try to keep up you potato.

    [[[
    I did no such thing. The true god’s oneness is unique in its plurality
    ]]]
    Amazing. Just amazing! Other then the fact that this is just a logical fallacy, you say that your god is one (in being) but this is still not the same as ours because he is three persons and contradict the sentence “I did no such thing”.

    You use the multi personality attribute to distinguish his oneness (in being, whatever the hell that means) from ours.

    In other words: you use another attribute of his (multi personality attribute) to make his oneness (in being) attribute seem different from ours;
    “Allah’s attribute of oneness is shared with creatures”
    Nop cus His oneness is uncreated while ours is created. But you see, you’ll say “but you can’t use Allah’s other attribute to make this one different from His creatures”. Which is the very same thing you do when you bring up the multi personality of your god. Just because the trinity is defined by using the attribute ‘one being’ and ‘multi personality’ attribute in the same definition doesn’t mean that one (being) and multi personality aren’t different attributes. They are TWO attributes! I am only asking about the first one (‘one being’ attribute) and you go ahead and bring up him being 3 persons yada yada yada.
    But I wasn’t even asking all of this. My attention was just on the Father alone. But you always bring it back your trinity which is not what I’m asking:
    [[[
    “You also go to ANOTHER attribute (consciousness) to say that the Father’s oneness is different from us.”
    I did no such thing. The true god’s oneness is unique in its plurality
    ]]]
    You see I ask you a question about the Father and you talk about the trinity deity as a whole. Not what I’m asking dude so stop dodging my question. Unless you believe the Father = the triune god (which would be another logical fallacy but hey we got used to hearing that from your side).
    The Father is ONE person and so are you. How is he then, by your “logic” (which xtians don’t have), different from you?

    April 1, 2018 • 11:59 am
    I have answered and put your pagan ass in its place for ALL to see. The only one running here is you, you coward.
    You don’t dare to answer my previous comment because you know what you said is bullshit!
    Try again loser.
    “I don;t accept your assertion that this is the case”
    That’s what the word literally means you idiot! It means to be ONE person.
    The point is that the Father is ONE person. ONE ONE ONE ONE ONE!!!
    Do you understand you idiot? ONE person.
    I am ONE person. So how is the Father being ONE person different from me being ONE person?
    But you will NEVER answer this because if you do then you refute yourself.
    “I have posted this several times, and not one of you towering intellects has been able to respond. What are you guys running away from?
    Allah’s attribute of oneness is shared with creatures”
    Bullshit! His oneness is uncreated while ours is created.
    You pretend as if 95% of my comment doesn’t exist and then claim you haven’t been answered.
    The I took your moronic “logic” and turned it against you.
    Answer these two questions little coward:
    1) How is the Father being ONE person (like Allah is ONE person) different from me being ONE person?
    2) How is the triune god’s (who doesn’t exist) attribute ‘ONE being’ different from me being ‘ONE being’?
    And I don’t want you to use any other attribute of your pagan deity (like his multi personality attribute).
    And don’t run to the Father’s OTHER attributes (like ‘him being part of the triune god’ attribute) nor bring the Son or the HS into this.
    Now watch brothers as this loser will dance around the questions and pretend as if he hasn’t gotten an answer to his moronic question.

    April 1, 2018 • 4:49 pm
    [[[[
    There you have it. Checkmate.
    Allah is one person like all humans, animals and angels. His oneness is not unique.
    ]]]]
    I said His oneness is uncreated. Try again.
    [[[[
    “The point is that the Father is ONE person.”
    Right. One of three positions contained within the being of the godhead. Completely unique in the universe. As you admitted, allah is not unique in the universe.
    “1) How is the Father being ONE person (like Allah is ONE person) different from me being ONE person?”
    The father is one person of the trinity who shares a will with the other two persons. Humans are not one person in a trinity.
    ]]]]
    Hahaha like I said, you run to the other attribute: multi personality. I asked you just about him being ‘one person’ and you bring in your moronic godhead and that he is a member of the trinity which is EXACTLY what I said you would do. So you use ANOTHER attribute to say that the Father’s oneness is different from ours. Checkmate xtian.
    [[[[
    “2) How is the triune god’s (who doesn’t exist) attribute ‘ONE being’ different from me being ‘ONE being’?”
    The one being of the triune god is triune – three persons in one being. You are saying the words, but lacking comprehension of them. No other being is triune.
    ]]]]
    And AGAIN (for the MILLIONTH time) you go to ANOTHER attribute (your moronic multi personality attribute) to say that his ‘ONE being’ attribute is different from ours. But I EXPLICITLY said not to do this cus you are using ANOTHER attribute. So in the solo attribute ‘ONE being’ He is EXACTLY the same as us, ergo you’re full of shit.
    [[[[
    “Bullshit! His oneness is uncreated while ours is created.”
    That doesn’t even make sense. You can;t even define what allah’s oneness means on its own terms.
    ]]]]
    LOL! But when I ask you how is the Father being ONE person different from us you then go ahead and say that He is part of the triune godhead which is another attribute. And when I ask you how does the ‘ONE being’ attribute of your triune god differ from ours then you jump to the multi personality attribute to explain how the ‘ONE being’ attribute is different from ours.
    So what the f do you want exactly???
    Can another attribute be used, to make the difference of the attribute in question from ours, or not???
    So either accept that Allah’s oneness is different from ours cus it’s uncreated or say ‘no you can’t look at another attribute’ and admit you’re full of shit. If one can’t use another attribute to make a difference of the attribute in question then start following your own advice: STOP USING THE MULTI PERSONALITY ATTRIBUTE OF YOUR GOD TO MAKE THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN HIM BEING ””ONE BEING”” AND US BEING ”’ONE BEING”’. STOP USING THE ATTRIBUTE ””THE FATHER BEING PART OF THE TRINITY”” ATTRIBUTE WHEN ASKED ABOUT HIS ””ONE PERSON”” ATTRIBUTE.
    You lose. Just accept it.Get over yourself.
    He didn’t assert anything. His claim was that the bible doesn’t go against the idea of there being another person in the godhead, ie it doesn’t limit the amount of persons to 3.
    And after not getting this simple argument you go to say that Muslims lose debates and (even more ironic) ‘the can’t reason logically’? Coming from an idiot who follows a religion which has more logical fallacies then any other religion on this planet.

    I ask you about the ‘ONE person’ attribute when it comes to the Father and AGAIN you jump to your triune god bullshit which is not what I was asking. The Father is a triune being??? Wahahaha! This is exactly the reason why I laugh at xtians! As moronic and self contradicting as their pagan garbage is, they can’t even make proper statements when it comes to their center doctrine. Pathetic!
    You moron, he is unitarian. He is ONE PERSON. In other words he is UNITARIAN. How the fuck can the Father be triune??? You just literally equaled the Father to the triune deity (i.e the Father, the Son and the HS). LOOOL!
    He is not 3 persons. He is ONE person. So again: How is the Father being ‘ONE person’ different from us? Go ahead loser, jump to the triune bullshit again and ignore the question. You don’t dare answer the question. That’s why everyone here can see you are getting your ass kicked.
    And one more funny thing is that you even called him ‘being’. So the Father is a being? What about the Son, is he a being too and the HS as well? Show the fuck do you have ‘ONE being’ when you consider them all three together. You get three beings! Your inner self even admits/knows that you believe in a self contradicting bullshit so you just can’t help it but to contradict yourself in every sentence.
    [[[[
    You really are embarrassing yourself here.
    ]]]]
    Good lord. What this greek/roman pagan bullshit has done to over 2 billion people on this planet. The most moronic self contradictory garbage ever invented by man and we have this braindead loser here saying “You really are embarrassing yourself here.”.
    You couldn’t make this shit up if your tried.
    [[[[
    You are completely incapable of explaining how allah’s oneness is unique on its own term
    ]]]]
    You mean like you are completely incapable of explaining how the Father’s oneness (= him being ONE person) is unique on its own term (i.e without jumping to the triune bullshit attribute) or like you are completely incapable of explaining how your pagan triune deity’s ‘ONE being’ attribute is unique on its own term (i.e without jumping to the multi personality attribute).
    Good job burying yourself and your pagan doctrine.
    Much appreciated.

    April 4, 2018 • 4:40 pm
    Brian,
    If God is Triune…….then why don’t the Jews believe it?
    Because the OT does not mention a Trinitarian God. The hebrew word “echad” means ONE in the same way that the Arabic word “Ahad” means and incomparable Divine One. Your Trinitarian doctrine forces you to interpret echad as “united” rather than Unity/One. Early Jews, Christians and Jesus himself believed in a Unitarian God and did not share in your own misinterpretations. Your weak arguments should end there.
    You said, “Jesus was a divine person who took on human nature – not like any other human being.” Except that Christian doctrine states that he was “Fully Human” like any other human being…..so you have committed heresy by saying that he was NOT like any other human being.
    You make allowance for your Jesus who supposedly incarnated into the avatar of a human creature, to be unlike creation, but you do not make same allowance for Allah who never did the same – Clear BIAS.
    Saying that God is one like creatures is an assertion on YOUR part, but I’m sure in your biased insincere mind you think THAT’S ok.
    Again, It is a strawman fallacy to arbitrarily separate uncreated nature apart from Unitarian nature. No one gave you the authority to separate.
    The uncreated Unitarian nature of God is ONE attribute/quality, as Almighty God Allah was uncreated in his absolute Unique and incomparable Oneness, therefore his primary necessary uncreated oneness is DIFFERENT and INCOMPARABLE to our secondary unnecessary created oneness.
    Also, I have shown previously that the Qur’an clarifies that Allah’s Oneness is “Incomparable” (Qur’an 112:4) and yet you keep comparing God to a creature.
    Why is it so hard for Christians to be intellectually honest about Islamic theology?
    April 4, 2018 • 4:54 pm
    Brian,
    You said, “Allah’s oneness is like mine – unitarian.” – EXCEPT that you are not an uncreated God.
    Let’s use your own logic and say God is three, so am I, flesh, bone, blood, God cannot be three things in one like his creatures, ergo God is not triune.
    Just as you insist that “There is no separation of the persons of the trinity.” We are free to insist that there is no separation between the uncreated Unitarian nature. You are not the sole arbiter here.

    Brian,
    You changed your tune quickly on the human nature of Jesus………so then in your understanding God is or at least for a time was like his creatures.
    As I explained previously Allah did not incarnate, because there was no NEED for an omnipotent, omniscient, eternal God to ever enter creation in the first place. See my further comments on this far above.
    By arguing against Islamic understanding of Unitarian God, you are also arguing against the Jewish understanding as well.
    The following Jewish descriptions of God’s Unitarian nature are in agreement with Islam:
    “While Judaism believes that G-d manifests Himself to His creation (humanity) in many ways, (i.e. as a judge or a protector) G-d’s essence itself is indivisible and therefore without any possibility of distinction. Something that transcends both time and space cannot be described as consisting of three different aspects. The moment we attribute any such distinctions to G-d’s essence, we negate His absolute Oneness and unity.” -https://jewsforjudaism.org/knowledge/articles/god-as-one-vs-the-trinity/
    “Missionaries incorrectly argue that the use in Deuteronomy 6:4 of the Hebrew word for One (Echad), rather than the word unique (Yachid), teaches that G-d is a “composite unity” instead of an “absolute unity.” They claim that the Trinity is a composite unity, similar to a physical object that includes many different individual aspects, (eg. one pen, composed of ink, plastic and metal). This reasoning is incorrect, since physical objects that exist within the context of time and space cannot be used to describe G-d who transcends these dimensions. Prior to Creation, G-d was alone and concepts of time, space and the plurality of numbers did not exist. The term unique (Yachid), correctly describes G-d’s existence prior to Creation since it indicates the absence of any plurality or of rapport with any created object.” https://jewsforjudaism.org/knowledge/articles/god-as-one-vs-the-trinity/
    The word “echad” in Hebrew actually works in the same way the word “one” does in English. It can mean either a single unity or a compound unity. These Christians are very quick to point to Genesis 1:5, fail to point out verses like these:
    “And Pharaoh sent, and, behold, there was not one of the cattle of the Israelites dead. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, and he did not let the people go.” Exodus 9:7
    “And it came to pass, while they were in the way, that tidings came to David, saying, Absalom hath slain all the king’s sons, and there is not one of them left.” 2 Samuel 13:30
    “So shall we come upon him in some place where he shall be found, and we will light upon him as the dew falleth on the ground: and of him and of all the men that [are] with him there shall not be left so much as one.” 2 Samuel 17:12
    “There is one [alone], and [there is] not a second; yea, he hath neither child nor brother: yet [is there] no end of all his labour; neither is his eye satisfied with riches; neither [saith he], For whom do I labour, and bereave my soul of good? This [is] also vanity, yea, it [is] a sore travail.” Ecclesiastes 4:8
    Bottom Line: If Tawheed of Islam is nonsense, then so is the oneness of God as described by your own Bible which clearly refutes Trinitarianism.
    April 4, 2018 • 6:13 pm
    Brian,
    We have offered a variety of explanation of God’s oneness on its own terms, even in ways in which the Jews explain the same Oneness of God. However, you simply deny the terms we offer, set up strawman arguments which misrepresent Islamic (and Jewish) theology and then act as if you have refuted something. You have proven nothing, except your own refusal to accept any argument contrary to your own preconceived notions and assertions.
    Once again – The Arabic words Ahad (Incomparable One) and Waahid (only One) are understood to mean that Allah is the ONE and ONLY uncreated Deity. The Unity, or Oneness of God’s singular being, is unique, absolute, incomparable, transcendent, indivisible, inherent. Absolute oneness is an intrinsic feature of Divinity alone.
    If you are only interested in basic numbers (which is wrong in approach) then at least understand that all others beside Him, in spite of existing, in comparison to His own Oneness, virtually amount to being equal to “Zero.”
    True insight into God’s absolute oneness cannot be attained without cleansing one’s heart, mind and soul of all forms of idols – apparent and hidden.
    April 4, 2018 • 7:22 pm
    Brian,
    “Explain God’s oneness on its own terms.”
    This article explains one Jewish response to the question based on analytic philosophy:
    https://judaismsanswer.com/UnityofGod.htm
    The Jewish author concludes that the proper way of looking at G-d’s attributes is that they do not apply to the essence of G-d, but that they are used in reference to actions that He does (will do) after the world has been created.
    Going by this understanding, the uncreated nature and oneness of God are NOT separate attributes as you incorrectly argue. But that rather, it is part and parcel of his uncreated inherent transcendent “essence” which is permanently indivisible (this precludes Trinity), eternally singular, and forever One Unitarian being.
    The Oneness of God is no mystery to Jews and Muslims. However, the unbiblical Trinitarian Godhead can only be described as a “mystery” and no amount of obfuscating argumentation, or denial can change that fact.
    There is nothing exciting about you being braindead. It’s rather sad.
    [[[Don;t get so excited over a slip of the tongue]]]
    Is this how you explain your failure and embarrassment?
    You can’t even use your own moronic argument for your own pagan deity. I ask how is your deity’s ‘ONE being’ attribute different from ours and you jump to his multipersonality attribute. You can’t explain how the Father being ‘ONE person’ attribute is different from ours without jumping to him being part of the trinity attribute. It’s so crystal clear you are dodging this fact and pretending as if you’re not going against your own standard.
    So according to your idiotic argument your pagan deity is like your hamster.
    I have destroyed you and your bullshit and everyone here knows it. You’re just so desperate to not accept your defeat that you can’t even see the pile of shit you’re in.
    You lost BADLY.

    What you fail to understand is that since God’s Unity is absolute, we must deal with him in totality. You cannot play one attribute or trait against another in order to justify your own false beliefs or actions. If you claim that God’s very Oneness is an attribute, then we are free to claim that each “person” of the Trinity is an attribute, and we argue further, why stop at Three? Or does you god have no more than three attributes? By claiming that the very Oneness of God is merely an attribute you set your triune God up for failure as well.

    April 5, 2018 • 6:00 pm
    Brian,
    Your request to explain Allah’s oneness on its own terms is based in the fallacy of Petitio Principii.
    You are begging the question in assuming your initial point that God’s Oneness MUST exclusively be explained on its own terms. The initial premise of your argument is bad, therefore, your argument is bad.
    Islamic (and Jewish) theology is not bound by the irrational false rules and premises of Trinitarian theology.
    The difference here is that both Muslims and Jews can refer to their respective scriptures and find clear references indicating the Unitary nature of God. Whereas, Christians have no biblical support for the Trinity…because Trinity is an UNBIBLICAL doctrine.
    April 6, 2018 • 11:04 am
    Clearly they are not – being unitarian is vastly different to being uncreated – they are two separate qualities or attributes. You have conflated them into one attribute because you are incapable of explaining how your god’s oneness essence is diffferent to any animal’s
    Just like being ‘ONE being’ and being ‘three persons’ are vastly different from one another – they are two separate qualities or attributes. You have conflated them into one attribute because you are incapable of explaining how your god’s ‘ONE being’ attribute is different to any animal’s.
    Just like being ‘ONE person’ and being ‘part of the trinity’ are vastly different from one another – they are two separate qualities or attributes. You have conflated them into one attribute because you are incapable of explaining how the Father’s ‘ONE person’ attribute is different to any animal’s.
    Thank you for bitchslapping yourself over and over and over and over, …
    I’m starting to sound like one of your incompetent scholars named mikey.
    “The guy is either stupid, intellectually dishonest, or both. He still hasn’t SIMPLY accepted or rejected a SIMPLE premise from my side.”
    He is both. You see they have there moronic self contradicting dogma that is SO BLATANTLY falls and goes against BASIC logic that they have to start inventing/using words like hypostasis or mystery or etc etc. And when we call it out for what it is (i.e. bullshit) then they jump to Islam and talk about Allah’s oneness somehow not making sense. Now they start mutilating the most simplistic thing about God in a desperate and pathetic attempt to “defend” the indefensible cus they have only two options: you either acknowledge your greek/roman pagan garbage as garbage or you deflect, dance around the issue, use fancy words, repeat yourself and pretend that refutes the bitchslapping you got on the very thing which you’re repeating and try and create this fictional “problem” about they’re being a problem with the most basic, simplistic and most logical thing there is (i.e the oneness of the One true God: Allah) while all the while ignoring your self invented argument (which is moronic beyond anything I have ever seen or heard) when asked to apply it on your pagan deity which consists of three deities while they are actually just one deity while they’re actually not while they actually are but are not.
    This is the brain damage that their cult has done. Lord have mercy.

    April 6, 2018 • 12:14 pm
    What’s the issue?
    My “oneness” is only a product of my relationship with other things similar to myself. I have arbitrary differentions.
    God’s “oneness” is the fact that it’s intrinsically impossible for there to be anything either similar OR dissimilar from Him ﷻ.
    And yes, the above ARE correlated with essential created/uncreatedness.
    And anyway, no, we are NOT unitary (the word that idiot means instead of unitarian). We are UNIONS in a state of UNITY. Only God is unitary, and even that’s metaphorical because that entire lexicon refers to bodily composition and form, and GOD IS NOT A BODY.
    I don’t understand what he doesn’t understand.
    [[[The quality of being three persons in one being is a unique attribute in its own right. Allah;’s oneness has no such uniqueness.]]
    I never said “How is the three persons in ONE being” attribute different from ours. You’re such a lying scum, it’s absolutely disgusting.
    I said how is him being ‘ONE being’ different from ours. You glue the attribute three persons to the ‘ONE being’ attribute and pretend that that’s what I am arguing which just makes you a lying piece of trash.
    According to your own argument if we say that your god’s ‘ONE being’ attribute is different because of his multi personality attribute then that makes them the same attribute. But they’re not the same attribute so you can’t differentiate the ‘ONE being’ attribute of your pagan deity on its own term (without bringing in the multi personality attribute). The same argument you use against Allah’s oneness attribute and His uncreatedness attribute.
    What a disingenuous filth you are. Lying and lying to the point of no return.
    So you loser. Get over it kid.
    April 6, 2018 • 4:05 pm
    [Glue? There’s no falsity on my part. In the doctrine of the trinity, god is three persons in one being – this is his nature.]
    And I wasn’t asking about the three persons. I asked about him being ONE being. Saying that it contains three persons is another attribute. Lying doesn’t help you.
    Your god is: – ONE being
    – three persons
    – tripersonal oneness (which is just a self contradicting bs)
    The third attribute is the combination of the first two.
    I ask you about the first attribute, then you in your desperation mode jump to the second attribute (three persons) and combine them (so that you get attribute numero 3) and pretend that that answers my question. Bringing attribute numero 2 or 3 does not even begin to answer my question and you know it.
    To say ‘the doctrine of the trinity’ and pretend that saying this makes attribute number 1 and number 2 not two attributes because they are mentioned within the same pagan doctrine is beyond moronic.
    So AGAIN: how does attribute numero uno (‘ONE being’ attribute) differ from ours WITHOUT jumping to attribute numero 2 (and hence combining them to get numero 3)?
    I’ll keep asking this over and over again but as always you wont have the balls to answer because it contradicts your own moronic argument.

    April 6, 2018 • 5:43 pm
    “Three persons in one being is a solitary attribute.”
    Wahaha.
    NO answer as expected.
    Pathetic loser.
    I’ll copy paste my past comment and let’s see if you’ll be in denial.
    Your god is: – ONE being
    – three persons
    – tripersonal oneness (which is just a self contradicting bs)
    The third attribute is the combination of the first two.
    I ask you about the first attribute, then you in your desperation mode jump to the second attribute (three persons) and combine them (so that you get attribute numero 3) and pretend that that answers my question. Bringing attribute numero 2 or 3 does not even begin to answer my question and you know it.
    To say ‘the doctrine of the trinity’ and pretend that saying this makes attribute number 1 and number 2 not two attributes because they are mentioned within the same pagan doctrine is beyond moronic.
    So AGAIN: how does attribute numero uno (‘ONE being’ attribute) differ from ours WITHOUT jumping to attribute numero 2 (and hence combining them to get numero 3)?
    How is your pagan deity’s ‘ONE being’ attribute different from ours without jumping to his multipersonality attribute?
    How is your pagan deity’s ‘ONE being’ attribute different from ours without jumping to his multipersonality attribute?
    How is your pagan deity’s ‘ONE being’ attribute different from ours without jumping to his multipersonality attribute?
    How is your pagan deity’s ‘ONE being’ attribute different from ours without jumping to his multipersonality attribute?
    How is your pagan deity’s ‘ONE being’ attribute different from ours without jumping to his multipersonality attribute?

    April 7, 2018 • 10:34 am
    You see this is exactly why you are such a disgusting, filthy, lying, dishonest lil shit.
    I took this moronic argument and just bitchslapped you with it and you still repeat yourself. Unbelievable!
    You can’t use another attribute to distinguish the attribute in question from ours you say???
    Can you then differentiate the ‘ONE being’ attribute of your pagan deity from ours without jumping to the multipersonality attribute? Can you differentiate the ‘ONE person’ attribute of the Father from ours without jumping to the ‘part of the trinity’ attribute?
    No! So shut the f up and get lost kid.
    According to your OWN argument (which is BEYOND stupid and idiotic and moronic with ZERO basis) if you say that the ‘ONE being’ attribute is different from ours BECAUSE he is multipersonal then that must require that we accept the silly premise that ‘ONE being’ and multipersonality are the same thing. Clearly they are not. Just a copy paste of your own shitty argument:
    [[For example, allah;’s oneness is different to mine because he is uncreated must require that we accept the silly premise that oneness and uncreatedness are the same thing. Clearly they are not.]]
    You have been answered and bitshlapped just like your predecessors. The reason why we referred to you as joel is because you are basically using the same bullshit as he was using.
    He got bitchslapped and now you continue the legacy.
    So for the millionth time crosstian:
    Can you differentiate the ‘ONE being’ attribute of your pagan deity from ours without jumping to the multipersonality attribute?
    Can you differentiate the ‘ONE person’ attribute of the Father from ours without jumping to the ‘part of the trinity’ attribute?
    Now watch brothers as this loser can’t defend its own position and will STILL argue that he is somehow winning the “debate”. Look at the braindamage that this moron is suffering. Look at how he will deflect AGAIN and not have the balls to answer these two simple questions because he knows he is full of shit. Watch as how he will jump to the multipersonality and the ‘part of the trinity’ attributes and hence FAIL again and get bitchslapped again.
    So come on loser let’s do this. Answer my questions honestly (which we all know ain’t gonna happen).

    April 10, 2018 • 8:05 pm
    When we say that God is near us without being in creation that is not considered to be a LOGICAL fallacy. Your pagan moronic god however is not one god but three gods and no matter how much you play the verbal gymnastics game of throwing in the word ‘person’ and the word ‘being’ into the self-contradiction it will still remain a self contradiction: A, B and C all equal X but yet A, B and C are not equal to one another. If you want to believe this, an error that a three year old can see, is not a self contradiction then I’ll let you live in your delusion.
    And if you want to pretend that God becoming man is not a logical fallacy (because to be man means NOT to be God) then I’ll let you play that game as well. The fact is that our God is the one True God who is the Almighty and who is far above from becoming part of creation. It’s the very fact that He is the Most Glorious and worthy of All praise that makes Him more than a loser god who becomes a man because that means he takes on the attributes of man that are not the attributes of God and hence cannot have doesn’t have those attributes in the first place.
    Allah isn’t ‘reliant’ on angels. What kind of moronic response did you just give? Since when does not being affected by space imply being in need of other beings?
    Leave that moronic dogshit cult before it completely fries you brain (or whatever is left of it).

    This pre assumes that being near us = being close in creation. This is false and you know it. If your god needs to be in creation to be ‘near us’ then you have a weak, pathetic god.
    If you can’t prove God can be near us without Him entering creation then don’t even bother responding cus it’s obvious you are doing damage control.

    1. If what I said is silly then your pagan trinity is silly. Your own doctrine says three persons in one being. The Father (A) is fully God (X), the Son (B) is fully God (X) and the HS (C) is fully God (X) but yet the Father, the Son and the HS are different from one another (i.e A \= B \= C). If you think that I don’t notice how you ignore what I said and simply throw out the word ‘silly’ in a desperate attempt to magically refute what I said then you are more pathetic than I thought. In that last bit of your comment you didn’t answer what I said. You are going against your own trinity. So answer this again instead of jumping to (O his will or O his whatever):
    The Father (A) is fully God (X), the Son (B) is fully God (X) and the HS (C) is fully God (X) but yet the Father, the Son and the HS are different from one another (i.e A \= B \= C).
    2. Even the pathetic attempt that you made just has more holes in it than a Swiss cheese. They have ‘one will’??? So then throw your bible out the window cus it jesus says:
    John 6:38
    “For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me”
    So the Son and the Father have different wills.
    Congrats you are an idiot.

    April 12, 2018 • 10:47 am
    The Father (A) = Yahweh (X) and The Son (B) = Yahweh.
    If A and B are different (and they are according to your pagan doctrine) and since they have different wills then they can’t be the same Yahweh. What kind of bullshit is this dogma, wahahahaha.
    The most MORONIC piece of garbage I have EVER seen. Everyone knows this is bullshit and yet look, just look at the horseshit they come up with to pretend it’s not a self contradicting bullshit.
    Unbelievable!!! How is this possible? How????

    Secondly
    I said A, B and C are different and you talk about them being equal in substance and will (even though they’re not) which has nothing to do with my argument. Talk about turning things upside down by attaking strawman and right after that accusing the other of strawmanning while he has done no such thing. My response is not strawman but YOURS is.
    The argument is that they are different, not that they don’t have anything that is equal. If the father, son and HS are all yahweh and they are still different from one another (as your pagan doctrine stay that the father is not the son and the son is not the HS and the HS is not the father) then that’s a contradiction.
    Bitchslap number two, ergo you and your pagan doctrine is pure bullshit..

    And there you go ladies and gentlemen. If you mention something that can’t be explained by the human nature then you jump to the god nature and pretend that that’s a refutation.
    When you say you worship Jesus I am talking about the PERSON who has both natures. For you to ignore that and just jump to the god nature and say ‘no no no we just worship the god nature part of jesus’ is FALSE. You can only worship a person. And jesus according to xtianity is a person that has two natures. So when someone worships him, he worships him completely without splitting him up cus of convenience.
    It’s a deal that comes with the whole package. If you worship someone then you worship the person fully.To worship jesus means you worship the person and since he is fully man as well, that means you are manworshipers.

    [[Okay, which of jesus’ human qualities do christians worship?]]]
    All of them. Jesus is (allegedly) god and man. So to worship jesus comes with the whole package. To worship jesus means to worship a person that has both natures (allegedly). So yes you are man worshipers.
    But now you have to play the ‘slice the pie’ game where you slice your pagan mangod up and only focus on his (alleged) divinity. This is false since jesus is ONE person. You cannot help but to divide him which isn’t possible (which early xtians try to do cus some of them believe he was two persons LOOL). So when something can’t be explained on the human part, you jump to his divine part and vice versa. This is heretical! Your own scholars are telling you this you idiot. You are NOT allowed to slice jesus up since he is one person. When an argument comes up that bitchslaps you, you are NOT allowed to say ‘o this only concerns his divine part and not his human part’. In other words when jesus says something or does something or has characteristics (that are mostly attributed to him since he never claimed them)
    like for example ‘worthy of worship’ (God forbid!) then this must apply to both natures. Jesus being one person doesn’t allow for the ‘slice the pie’ game. This is exactly the reason why there were early xtians who held this view and that’s why they thought jesus was literally two persons.
    But you can’t help yourself, i know! You can’t defend the indefensible.
    Sad panda.
    [[[No christian worships jesus’ humanity.]]]
    Yea keep telling yourself that. If that’s the case then he ain’t human and hence the double nature is pure bullshit (which it is anyways).
    [[[Now go ahead and explain allah’s oneness? Remember using other attributes to describe it equates those two attributes, so you can;t say allah’s oneness is different because he is uncreated because that means that the two are identical.]]]
    I will if you (after me so many times asking you but you playing the avoid game like the lil cowardly shit that you are) explain how the father’s ‘one person’ attribute is different from ours. Remember using other attributes to describe it equates those two attributes, so you can’t say the father’s ‘one person’ attribute is different because he is ‘part of the trinty’ because that means that the two are identical.
    I will if you explain how the yahweh’s ‘one being’ attribute is different from ours. Remember using other attributes to describe it equates those two attributes, so you can’t say the yahweh’s ‘one person’ attribute is different because he of his multipersonality (disorder) because that means that the two are identical.
    But but but but the trinity has three persons in them and the father is is is not alone cus there two more persons he like to do the tango with and and and…
    Don’t give a rats ass about your trinity nor you ‘existence of other persons’ since that’s not what I asked and they are different attributes. So take your strawmans and shove it up your *** and give real answers .

    April 14, 2018 • 10:00 am
    Still repeating yourself? Still no balls to answer my questions?
    As expected!
    Thx for proving your argument is pure bullshit and that it can be used against your own pagan god.
    Run loser, ruuuuuuuuuuuuun!
    How is the father’s ‘one person’ attribute different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the ‘but but but there are also 2 more persons and and and he is part of the trinity god’ attribute?
    How is yahweh’s ‘one being’ attribute different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the multipersonailty attribute?
    Just answer these questions you cowardly shitstain. You are pathetic as is your non existing god. Where are you microscopic balls? Why do they shrink to nanoscopic balls when confronted with the truth???
    Are you that cowardly? Is this bullshit cult of yours that indefensible? Are you that pathetic that you are so afraid to answer my questions?
    You can’t defend your moronic god. I ask you CRYSTAL clearly:
    How is the father’s ‘one person’ attribute different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the ‘but but but there are also 2 more persons and and and he is part of the trinity god’ attribute?
    How is yahweh’s ‘one being’ attribute different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the multipersonailty attribute?
    and all you can do is be the fucking cowardly shitstain that you are and dodge my questions and come up with your trinity which I don’t give a fuck about! Wasn’t asking about it.
    ANSWER the questions.
    How is the father’s ‘one person’ attribute different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the ‘but but but there are also 2 more persons and and and he is part of the trinity god’ attribute?
    How is yahweh’s ‘one being’ attribute different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the multipersonailty attribute?
    How is the father’s ‘one person’ attribute different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the ‘but but but there are also 2 more persons and and and he is part of the trinity god’ attribute?
    How is yahweh’s ‘one being’ attribute different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the multipersonailty attribute?
    How is the father’s ‘one person’ attribute different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the ‘but but but there are also 2 more persons and and and he is part of the trinity god’ attribute?
    How is yahweh’s ‘one being’ attribute different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the multipersonailty attribute?
    How is the father’s ‘one person’ attribute different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the ‘but but but there are also 2 more persons and and and he is part of the trinity god’ attribute?
    How is yahweh’s ‘one being’ attribute different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the multipersonailty attribute?
    How is the father’s ‘one person’ attribute different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the ‘but but but there are also 2 more persons and and and he is part of the trinity god’ attribute?
    How is yahweh’s ‘one being’ attribute different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the multipersonailty attribute?
    How is the father’s ‘one person’ attribute different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the ‘but but but there are also 2 more persons and and and he is part of the trinity god’ attribute?
    How is yahweh’s ‘one being’ attribute different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the multipersonailty attribute?
    But you won’t!!! Because we all know what will happen. We all know what the answers to these questions are:
    The father is one person just like I am one person and no matter how many other persons there are besides him, no matter the son or the holy potato, the father is still one person. So according to your absolute dogshit logic: he must be like me!
    Yahweh is one being just like I am one being. Being three personal doesn’t change that. He still remains ONE being like me. So yahweh is like me!
    Bitchslapped over and over and over again.
    But the response will be:
    but but but but but the trinityyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy is soooooo differeeeeeeeeeeeent.
    and so yet again the fucker won’t answer the question and claim a hollow victory.
    logos is word
    does the logos have words of its own? are the words of the logos differentiated with the logos ? you put them in a relationship ,
    relationship requires two separate existences and in relationships conversations take place so then the logos chats with his father. they are a couple. the relationship has to work in terms of behaviour towards each other. one behaves as son , the other respects his father as his parent.

    April 12, 2018 • 8:07 am
    “The Logos has equality with the Father by nature because it is God. It is subordinate to the Father through the human nature which it has assumed.”
    lets assume that you are born the same time as your father (same age)
    you have same power and strength as your father
    the human nature , according to crosstian ORTHODOXY still makes CLAIMS as the father
    ” i am”
    but this same person says :
    For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.
    but the trinitarian jesus has everything his father has and he has full access/is the one who is “one” in commanding because they all have same thing .
    why is “god on earth” requiring permission to say ” i am yhwh” ?
    1. the son is playing a stage play and PRETENDING
    2. the son is not pretending, the human nature DOMINATED over his mind
    lets say that you have everything your father has , you are born the same time and you have the same power as your father
    you subordinate to your father even though you are same age and have same power
    1. you are pretending and say that “my father is greater than me”
    2. your NEW nature dominated (lets assume you took on animal nature) and caused you to say ….
    but this only show what i was originally showing
    in christianity you have visible and changed gods who all must be co-eternal otherwise yhwh can never come in relationship with creatures.

    Buahahahaha! You didn’t show ANYTHING!
    And we already bitchslapped you on your idiotic argument of oneness.
    You don’t have the balls to answer my question you crossworshiping coward:
    How does the Father’s ‘one person’ attribute differ from ours WITHOUT jumping to the ‘part of the trinity’ attribute?
    How does yahweh’s ‘ONE being’ attribute differ from ours WITHOUT jumping to his multipersonality attribute?
    You are such a fucking loser!

    “How does yahweh’s ‘ONE being’ attribute differ from ours WITHOUT jumping to his multipersonality attribute?”
    His tirunity is his attribute and no one else’s. They are not different attributes – you are trying to hide the fact that your “god’s” oneness is just like all creatures. he is not god, ergo.]
    Wahahahaha he can’t help himself. He can’t answer the question. God I love bitchslapping this loser. It’s my favorite hobby.
    One being and 3 person are DIFFERENT attribute you lil shitstain. My God’s oneness is uncreated.
    So again:
    How does yahweh’s ‘ONE being’ attribute differ from ours WITHOUT jumping to his multipersonality attribute?
    How does the Father’s ‘one person’ attribute differ from ours WITHOUT jumping to the ‘part of the trinity’ attribute?
    Come on! Give me little bit of challenge
    Your god is one being just like I am one being so according to your moronic argument he is like me. DOesn’t matter wether he is allegedly 3 persons or not, that’s not what I am asking. I am one being and one person. He is one being and three persons. I am asking you how is that one being different from ours WITHOUT jumping to the multipersonality shit. You can’t, ergo you’re full of shit.

    Trinity = ONE being and consisting of three persons
    One being is 1 attribute and three persons is 1 attribute. Combining these two you get the trinity. Are you still with me you lowlife or is this to hard for ya? Stay with me just stay with me, keep those two braincells of yours on active duty just a little longer.
    So again: ONE being = 1 attribute and three persons = 1 attribute.
    Trinity = Combination(One being, three persons)
    I am asking aobut the ONE being attribute. I don’t give a flying fuck about the three persons attribute nor do I care for your non existing trinity attribute (which is the combo of the two attributes).
    My question is solo on the ‘One being’ attribute. So again you lil shitstain:
    How does yahweh’s ‘ONE being’ attribute differ from ours WITHOUT jumping to his multipersonality attribute?

    No they are not. They are solitary attribute because they are solitary attribute? Talk about going in circles!
    Nice try. This is what you have to do in order to play the avoid game.
    I can just as easily say that Allah’s oneness and his uncreatedness are solitary because His oneness is uncreated. So if we go this route then you lose as well. But of course you’ll be in denial and say ‘no they are not’ and pretend that your say-so has any value. What a simple minded fool you are. But then again you are a crosstian.
    Can you please man up? Just man up and try and defend your pagan bullshit.
    How does the Father’s ‘one person’ attribute differ from ours WITHOUT jumping to the ‘part of the trinity’ attribute?
    How does yahweh’s ‘ONE being’ attribute differ from ours WITHOUT jumping to his multipersonality attribute?
    ‘ONE being’ and multipersonality are different attributes. DIFFERENT. DIFFERENT. DIFFERENT.
    I knew you would say what you said in your previous comment because you have no choice if you want to keep playing this game. Now that I have bitchslapped you with these questions, you HAVE to lie and deceive by just coming up with bullshit like ‘solitary attribute’.
    An attribute is a characteristic that the individual possesses. Your pagan god is ‘one being’ (1 characteristic) and 3 persons (another characteristic).
    So basically this loser’s argument is that Allah’s attribute(s) are same as ours on their own accord but his pagan god’s isn’t because everytime you ask him the same question in return he’ll claim ‘solitary’ as if that refutes anything.
    Find a better excuse to dodge my questions.
    Besides why don’t you answer the question about the father?
    LOL or are you gonna claim that ‘one person’ and ‘existence of 2 more persons’ are ‘solitary’?
    Buahahaha!
    The kid got schooled again.

    Like

  11. stewjo004

    @ Joel

    I don’t think you understand what I’m saying. Two of God’s names are “Al Ahad” and “Al Wahid”. Meaning “THE One” and “THE Unique One” roughly. I don’t know what you or Paulus are talking about I’ve never said that He is One because He is One. You asked the meaning to the two names above and I told you what’s an addition to the meaning to make them Unique. I’ve read my answer three times and there’s no circular reasoning anywhere in my post.

    Next, as for my Bible passage, the Trinity as per definition means they are separate but equal in essence. Cool, how can this passage mean they are equal:

    16“My teaching is NOT My own,” Jesus replied. “It comes from Him who SENT Me. 17If anyone desires to do His will, he will know whether MY teaching is from God OR whether I speak on My own. 18He who speaks on his own authority seeks his own glory, but He who seeks the glory of the One who sent Him is a man of truth; in Him there is no falsehood. (John 7:16-17)

    In trinitarian theology this passage would mean:
    God’s teaching is not God’s but is from God who sent God? If you desire to do God’s will you’ll know if God’s teaching (that is not His) is God’s if God speaks from God or if God is speaking from His own authority? If God speaks on His own He seeks His glory but if He seeks the glory of God who sent Him then there is no lie?

    t’s an illogical sequence. The author of John did not believe in the Trinity he believed Jesus(as) was a divine pre-existent being but definitely not equal to God.

    Liked by 1 person

      1. Joel

        q and bs

        Hey Stew, did you notice how Coco suddenly went silent on the bacteria? I guess we hurt the ignoramus’ feelings!

        I’ve been busy converting muslims to the faith, sorry for the late reply. Also, I’m having trouble getting stew to understand simple logical thinking which has kept me preoccupied.

        Sadly, you are an idiot. Genetic material from the food we eat has been found to integrate into our bodies on a functional level, i.e. genetic material is exchanged with our own from the food we eat. Does that mean we are “paired” with the food we eat?

        You just can’t defend the stupid nonsense that your “holy” book spews. No, bacteria do not need other bacteria to reproduce. Some exchange genetic material, but that does not make them “pairs”.

        Allah fails again!

        Like

      2. LOL!! You just keep exposing your ignorance and arrogance! You just can’t admit that you and your holy spirit are ignorant of biology, can you?

        Now pay attention moron. Bacteria form pairs during conjugation. The F+ bacterium transfers genes to the F- bacterium. That is LITERALLY a pair!

        But to further humiliate you, consider that Bacteria are part of one of two possible “domains” of life. Scientists classify organisms into two domains: Prokarya and Eukarya.

        Prokarya is divided into the Archaea and Eubacteria. Eukarya is divided into Prostista, Fungi, Plantae and Animalia. So you see, my ignorant little monkey, another pair for bacteria would be Eukaryotic organisms, since bacteria are prokaryotic. Ergo, the Quran is correct!

        In contrast, your laughable scripture refers to rabbits as ruminants, when they are in fact monogastric herbivores. Your Bible says vegetation existed on Earth before the sun was created. Your Bible calls the sun and moon “lights” even though the moon merely reflects the sun’s light. Taken all together, your Bible is utterly nonsensical. You just can’t defend the stupid nonsense that your “holy” book spews nor can you admit that bacteria exist in pairs. The ability to exchange genetic information is important for survival. It plays a central role in reproduction. If you had even some basic biological knowledge, you would understand. Alas, you are a crosstian, so knowledge doesn’t mean anything to.

        Liked by 1 person

    1. Joel

      stew

      You asked the meaning to the two names above and I told you what’s an addition to the meaning to make them Unique. </blockquote
      No I did not.

      I don’t think you understand what I’m saying. Two of God’s names are “Al Ahad” and “Al Wahid”. Meaning “THE One” and “THE Unique One” roughly. I don’t know what you or Paulus are talking about I’ve never said that He is One because He is One.

      Yes, you are saying that allah is one because he is one – that is circular. Your answer above shows how confused you are – you are so brainwashed by islam that you can;t even see that you are talking in circles. Now, please explain how allah’s oneness is different to the oneness of cows, dogs, goats and any other creatures?

      Next, as for my Bible passage, the Trinity as per definition means they are separate but equal in essence. Cool, how can this passage mean they are equal:

      You just can’t open your mouth without spewing logical fallacies can you? LOL!!!

      You have presumed the conclusion of you argument in your argument when it is the conclusion that you should be proving. I see no conflict with these passages and the truth of the trinity. Please demonstrate your point – you are not making any sense.

      Like

  12. “….not function vis-a-vis salvation”

    yeah, pagan SEPARABLE beings . pagan SEPARABLE consciousnesses . a cursed kafir like u is a polytheist .
    now explain how is the being of the father, DIFFERENT the my being .

    Like

  13. stewjo004

    @ Joel

    You asked how is God’s oneness different from creations?
    My answer He has no equal or pair.

    That is not circular. Please research the thing you are accusing me of:

    Logical Form:

    X is true because of Y.

    Y is true because of X.

    Example #1:

    Pvt. Joe Bowers: What are these electrolytes? Do you even know?

    Secretary of State: They’re… what they use to make Brawndo!

    Pvt. Joe Bowers: But why do they use them to make Brawndo?

    Secretary of Defense: [raises hand after a pause] Because Brawndo’s got electrolytes.

    Next please explain the Bible passage in light of the Trinitarian understanding. How can Jesus’s(as) teaching not be his own but be God’s if he is God?

    Like

    1. Joel

      stew

      You asked how is God’s oneness different from creations?
      My answer He has no equal or pair.

      Oh, I see! Allah has no equal or pair, meaning that he is alone, or “one”? Point proven – you are arguing that allah is one because he is one, AKA,”circularity”.

      Now please explain how allah’s oneness is different to a goat’s?

      Like

      1. stewjo004

        First, you have yet to explain that Biblical passage I quoted in light of Trinitarian understanding.

        Two, what is your proof from the Biblical text that God “transcended” time and space and saved all the souls that died at the exact same time. When they had no prophet or any of God’s teachings? If you have no proof for what you said (which I doubt you do) Then please answer my original point about God’s justice and ALL the nations of the Earth.

        Three, you asked how is God’s oneness unique to Him. The premise of your question is to prove how God is One. So it is not circular to demonstrate how God is distinctly One. Any answer I give proving His oneness you would argue because that was your intent no matter what, you just weren’t expecting my answer and thought I would just focus on the numerical value. But let’s set that aside for a moment on a more basic level do you disagree that God is One Joel?

        Liked by 1 person

      2. “Oh, I see! Allah has no equal or pair, meaning that he is alone, or “one”? Point proven – you are arguing that allah is one because he is one, AKA,”circularity”.”

        when a goat dies, how is is ONE person DIFFERENT than the fathers person ?

        when a goats BEING dies , how is it DIFFERENT THAN the being (what) of triune being .

        your pagan “echad” is REALLY a composite just like one person (who) in one what (being) ? do you not see?

        so how is your gods “who” different than mines? how is his ONE what different than mines ?

        Like

      3. ” you are arguing that allah is one because he is one, AKA,”circularity”.”

        father = 1 PERSON in BEING

        tom = one person IN being

        now tell me how the “ONE being” is different than a maggots ONE BEING ?

        do you not see? tell me how the one PERSON which is SEPARATED from being, is DIFFERENT than my ONE person, after i die, donkey dies, sheep dies, maggot dies?

        Like

      4. father = one person in ONE being

        tom = one person in one being

        minus father from being , what do we see? one person. how is the fathers one person different than toms one person when tom dies. fathers ONENESS and toms ONENESS is the same.

        tom left his being
        father left his being

        how is toms and fathers ONE BEING different from each other, they are one, as in number 1. ONE. one

        Like

      5. quote :
        you are arguing that allah is one because he is one, AKA,”circularity”.

        how many is the father ?
        how many is the son?

        how many is the “one BEING ” ?

        Like

      6. Joel

        stew

        First, you have yet to explain that Biblical passage I quoted in light of Trinitarian understanding.

        No, first to have to demonstrate how the passage contradicts the trinity – you haven’t – before you can demand an explanation.

        Two, are you suggesting that God does not transcend space and time and that he is constrained in his actions by his own created phenomena? Kind of like allah being incapable of entering his own universe? LOL!

        And where did I say that previous generations had no prophet or any of god’s teachings? There are numerous passages that teach redemption coming from the Messiah. The bible is clear that God has been with man since the beginning – muslims on the other hand claim that islam has been taught to all previous generations. Where is the evidence for this? What are the names of these prophets?

        Three, you asked how is God’s oneness unique to Him. The premise of your question is to prove how God is One. So it is not circular to demonstrate how God is distinctly One. Any answer I give proving His oneness you would argue because that was your intent no matter what, you just weren’t expecting my answer and thought I would just focus on the numerical value. But let’s set that aside for a moment on a more basic level do you disagree that God is One Joel?

        No, I asked how allah’s oneness is different to a goat’s or any creature’s. That aside, you still can’t get away from circular reasoning – allah’s oneness is unique because he is one? That’s circular – you need to refund your Imam Training tuition fees if that’s the best they can’t teach you. Yahweh’s triune oneness is unique – no other entity in the universe has this quality. Allah’s oneness is like mine, yours, and every other creature’s.

        Your argument is that there is only one god and that is a trite and meaningless explanation of “oneness”.

        Also, you have run away from the question of what is the opposite of satan?

        Like

      7. “Two, are you suggesting that God does not transcend space and time and that he is constrained in his actions by his own created phenomena? Kind of like allah being incapable of entering his own universe? LOL!”

        so yhwh entered creation then ? how much of yhwh entered creation ? was it one person who has oneness like a maggot ? since yhwh entered creation , how was it yhwh, when what people saw was a CREATED being. so does this mean, according to the bible, if yhwh enters creation , he becomes created ? what uncreated features of this god were seen? how does one who is smashed by his own creation claim to be “yhwh” ? your god had such an URGE to exprience crapping and pissing that he had to come down to take a crap in a hole in israel? did he forsee this even before he came down ?

        “. The bible is clear that God has been with man since the beginning”

        where did the bible say that yhwh was going to curse himself /become curse ? torah please.

        “.” Yahweh’s triune oneness is unique ”

        since one testicle has millions of persons in it (sperm) is yhwhs oneness like one testicle?

        tell me about the father

        father is ONE person IN one being .

        tom is ONE person, in ONE being.

        is the fathers person THE same as a goats person when goat DIES ?

        is the BEING of the goat the same as the “one being” you worship ?

        your gods “being” is not UNIQUE , it is COMPOSITE. it is JUST like created parts GLUED together.

        Like

      8. ” triune oneness”

        what is “triune” ? what is “oneness” ?

        is “triune” TRANSFORMED to one?
        does triune merge with one?

        is triune IN one ?

        what do you mean? we don’t understand.

        how is the one BEING (EXTERNAL part) different than a DONKEY, sheep, testicle, goat, maggot ?

        how is EACH internal being/person DIFFERENT to a testicle, goat, donkey, maggot in oneness ?

        Like

      9. “Two, are you suggesting that God does not transcend space and time and that he is constrained in his actions by his own created phenomena?”

        your god is constrained by time and space, if he carries his powers , he will destroy everything , like an uncontrollable rolocoaster pagan balian diety. so yhwh isin trouble. he has problem carrying his powers over so he chooses to become a shitting, pissing and farting diety because he had desperate urge to take a sh**t in a hole in israel.

        maybe on some other planet has his monthly menses.

        maybe in indian a cow feed a whole village.

        but anyway, does this imply that the created person in the trine being was INFINITELY part of the one being of yhwh ? how did your god even kick start creation if their was no CREATED finite part INFINITE part of the triune being ? tell me, why does a god need to enter CREATION when he created it ? did he enter creation like a builder enters his own creation when building a house ? is your pagan diety so CONSTRAINED that he has no choice but to ENTER in a building to do his building ?

        Like

  14. “I’ve been busy converting muslims to the faith, sorry for the late reply. Also, I’m having trouble getting stew to understand simple logical thinking which has kept me preoccupied.”

    it has been nearly 3 and a half weeks and neither joel or paulus can help barry jones see the light

    Frank Turek’s Bible Error # 1: God cannot allow sin to go unpunished?
    https://turchisrong.blogspot.com/2018/08/frank-tureks-bible-error-1-god-cannot.html

    the triunes gods rape of non-jews, neither commented.
    now i bring forth an article about yhwhs “justice”
    will any of them help jones see the light?

    Liked by 1 person

  15. stewjo004

    @ Joel

    All the beings of the Trinity are God, right? Okay then how can Jesus(as) who is God not teach God’s teachings? This passage makes no sense in Trinitarian belief. I’m asking you to explain this passage in light of trinitarian teachings it’s not that difficult to see the problem:

    16“My teaching is NOT My own,” Jesus replied. “It comes from Him who SENT Me. 17If anyone desires to do His will, he will know whether MY teaching is from God OR whether I speak on My own. 18He who speaks on his own authority seeks his own glory, but He who seeks the glory of the One who sent Him is a man of truth; in Him there is no falsehood. (John 7:16-17)

    Or if you prefer why don’t you explain this verse that the Church Fathers struggled with?

    1When Jesus had spoken these things, He lifted up His eyes to heaven and said… 3Now this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, AND Jesus Christ, whom You have sent. (John 17:1-3)

    I want you to explain “the unity of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit as three persons in one Godhead according to Christian dogma”

    Next, claimed that God transcended time and space and saved all souls. What is the Biblical evidence for that?

    Moving on you said, ” where did I say that previous generations had no prophet or any of god’s teachings?” So are you arguing for earlier prophets or not because that section of your post was confusing.

    Furthermore, we’ve established that pagan Hindus believe in the Trinity so it’s not even a unique religious belief. Even when you explain the Trinity using various examples, such as water, an egg, nuclear fission, a three-headed dragon, a tree, etc. shows it’s not unique in the universe. God being alone in the universe explains the uniqueness of Him being One perfectly, you’re simply being argumentative.

    Satan’s opposite. I would argue Adam.
    Father of demons= Father of mankind
    In disobedience, one continued in arrogance the other repented in humbleness
    One is racist the other encompasses all races.
    Satan was unknowledgeable (for example the various animal names) while Adam was knowledgeable (of the animal’s names)
    Disbeliever/ Hypocrite=Believer
    One is in the matter of the unseen while Adam is within our realm.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Paulus

      @joel

      It appears you’ve snookered stew with his “no equal or partner” distinction. Notice how to give Satan an equal he has to appeal to adam. Who then is eve’s equal!?

      The circularity continues…

      Like

      1. LOL, you morons are really silly! Why can’t the same creation be a pair for multiple other creations? Adam and Eve are a pair in one way, whereas Adam and Satan are a pair in another way. It’s really quite simple. Another way to look at it is that since Satan is a Jinn, which are supernatural beings, they’re opposite in the pair are angels. Any way you look at it, the crosstian argument (and especially the appeal to science)
        fails miserably.

        I love how the crosstians are so scared to defend the pesudoscientific nonsense in their Bible!

        Liked by 1 person

    2. Joel

      stew

      Sorry to be so blunt, but you are a bit pathetic.

      I don’t see an problem for the trinity in the passages you quote. Now, if you have an argument to make for why it is a problem then I think you should make it.

      Moving on you said, ” where did I say that previous generations had no prophet or any of god’s teachings?” So are you arguing for earlier prophets or not because that section of your post was confusing.

      No I’m saying that god’s message was given through the first man and that the message of a redeeming messiah runs throughout the bible. I can list the verse for you if you want, but all you are doing is trying to avoid explaining the oneness of your god.

      You cannot do it coherently, so you are throwing out these red herrings. So please, one more time try to explain how allah;s oneness is different to a goat’s?

      So far, you have argued that allah’s oneness is different because he is one, and then you have tried to say that another attribute – “uniqueness” – is what makes allahs oneness different. This is a clear non-sequitur – all creatures are unique, that is not a unique attribute to allah. So bascially you are saying “allah is one because he is one, alone, and that this makes him unique because he is one”!!!

      You sound very confused by your faith.

      I see you have found the courage to answer about satan, but you have embarrassed yourself. Where in the quran does it say that satan and adam are opposites? Again, you have had to resort to fallacious argument by moving the goalposts: are human made in pairs with other humans or in pairs with supernatural beings? Do you even know what you are talking about? Is adam a supernatural being? WHere is Eve in all of this? You have failed miserably.

      Your tauheed makes no sense to anyone, including you! LOL!!

      Next, claimed that God transcended time and space and saved all souls. What is the Biblical evidence for that?

      “I AM” – that is, he is the god of the living, not of the dead. Try to think about it……..

      Also, are you saying that allah cannot transcend space and time? Allah’s work is constrained by space and time? Allah is not god then.

      Furthermore, we’ve established that pagan Hindus believe in the Trinity so it’s not even a unique religious belief.

      The christian trinity predates the trimurti and is a completely different doctrine – you haven’t even understood the links you have been posting.

      God being alone in the universe explains the uniqueness of Him being One perfectly, you’re simply being argumentative.

      Yes, allah is one because he is one – circularity at its most clear.

      Paulus

      I know – stew has no idea what he is talking about. Three “beings” of the trinity? LOL!!!

      Like

  16. stewjo004

    @ Paulus and Joel
    The nature of your question is to show how God’s oneness is unique from creation’s oneness. The only way the answer will end is how He is One and Alone from everything else. It’s not circular it’s the nature of the question you asked.

    Also please take a logic class because comparing Adam to Satan s not “moving the goal post” in the question you asked. Final pont I apologize for nit using the pagan philosophical terms you’ve all made up. However, even then a “being” is synonymous with “person”
    https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/person

    @ QB
    Thank you for summing up what I was thinking. According to them apparently, things can’t be pairs of multiple things.

    But what I find most annoying about Paulus and Joel is when they clearly don’t know an answer they divert. For example, I’m talking about the rest of mankind outside of Israel Joel is talking about Messianic themes in the Bible. I ask them to explain the passages I quoted in light of trinitarian belief. All they do is try to talk about Tawheed and avoid explaining it. I ask for textual evidence from Joel about his claim he goes off into a philosophical tirade.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. stewjo004

      @ QB
      All they do is try to make philosophical arguments or claim fallacies they don’t understand. Notice that they rarely bring textual evidence to discussions. That’s why when I picked apart the gospel’s passion narratives, for example, they had to remain silent because there’s no philosophical tangent to run with its just pure text on text.

      Liked by 1 person

      1. Paulus

        I didn’t realise you could read minds and know motives?

        Or perhaps the old tired claims of “contradiction” have been debated as nauseum for centuries? Or are you so arrogant to assume you produced anything new?

        Let’s be honest here. You frequently link to “discover the truth” so we all know you are simply rewriting others claims.

        Hence discussing it is as useful as doing sholat!! Useless!!

        Like

      2. Or perhaps the claims have never been refuted by crosstians, and hence the need to pound crosstians with the truth that they don’t want to admit?

        Let’s be honest here. You simply accept the excuses that have been spoon-fed to you by “conservative” scholars so we all know you are simply rewriting others’ bogus claims, and you probably know in the back of your mind that they are BS.

        Hence, pounding you with it and seeing you run is pretty damn useful and funny!!

        Like

      3. I wonder if that’s why you can’t or won’t define what “post pubescent” means. It’s not something you can run to your conservative scholars for an answer, mostly because the answer they will give you is not what you want to hear. LOL!!

        Like

      4. LOL! Did you see that Stew? Cerbie still will not be specific!

        Cerbie, surely you can do better? How long will you remain a coward? Come on, doggie. You already know your answer is vague. Puberty can start at different ages, so “post” can be at different ages too. So come on. Grow a spine and give a definitive answer!

        Like

    2. Joel

      stew

      The nature of your question is to show how God’s oneness is unique from creation’s oneness. The only way the answer will end is how He is One and Alone from everything else. It’s not circular it’s the nature of the question you asked.

      It is circular. You have admitted that your definition of the “lah’s” oneness is circular and therefore, illogical.

      Also please take a logic class because comparing Adam to Satan s not “moving the goal post” in the question you asked.

      Please take a class in how to reason logically. Your original claim was that the “lah” made everything in pairs and this is one of the ways that you tried – and failed – to show how your “god’s” oneness was different to a pidgeon’s. Clearly, adam and satan were not made as a “pair”, Adam and eve were made as a pair. The question of who is opposite of satan remains unanswered.

      So, we have now had over 120 comments and even an imam cannot answer this simple question about the “lah’s” oneness. No wonder tony the psycho gets so angry – his religion makes no sense.

      Like

    1. Joel

      fatass partpig

      So far, q and bs has not censored, deleted, or otherwise blocked the free exchange of ideas on his blog. Kudos to his for that. On BT Paul Williams was so weak in his faith that he did not tolerate any questioning that he could not answer – which was alot of questioning. So what you call “bitchslapping” was actually Williams banning people for raising points he could not answer.

      But nice try. So far even an imam can’t explain how the “lah’s” oneness is different to animals.

      Like

      1. yahs oneness is no different than my left testicle , since it EXISTS as one being. the persons/sperm and in my left testicle. see, i found a match for yhw, what do you think ?

        Liked by 1 person

      2. LOL, nice job Tony! You have completely baffled this moronic trinitarian! Notice how he still won’t answer how each individual person in the trinity is different in “oneness” from everyone else.

        As far as Tony’s language, hey look, he’s a passionate guy. I don’t agree with it, and I do censor the bad language occasionally, but it’s not feasible to moderate every post. I do ask brother Tony to tone down the language.

        Like

      3. Atlas Partridge

        1) PW has nothing to do with our responses to you whether on his blog or on this one. We had a discussion about this topic which had hundreds of comments going back and forth and you lost, badly! You clearly live by the principle that if you get beaten down then just repeat the same bs over and over again and pretend you are somehow winning. To now shift the attention to PW is simply pathetic.

        2) Talking about bs, brother Q&B’s account name is Qur’anAndBibleBlog. So to say “So far, q and bs has…” points to the latter part of his account name (which includes your ‘holy’ scripture) as being bs. You tried to be fancy but it backfired like a sever bitchslap. What a way to embarrass yourself even further as if you hadn’t done that enough already. You’re not very bright, are you?

        3) Coming back to what has got to be one of the most moronic ‘arguments’ I have ever heard in my life: If you are so keen on pretending to have the upper hand then you would have answered the arguments I raised against you on PW’s blog along time ago.
        Allah’s oneness is uncreated while ours is created. If you want to respond back by saying that I use the uncreated attribute to show his uniqueness instead of just relying on the oneness attribute alone then I kindly ask you to also ONLY rely on the one being attribute of your triune god. The oneness comes from the ‘ONE being’ attribute, NOT the ‘three persons’ attribute. You just slide the latter in there while it’s a separate attribute (otherwise they would be identical). In other words: your god is one being just like I am one being. Is he like me now?
        And if your response will be: “But but but but he is threeeeeeeeeeeee persons.” Then I want to thank you for one again confirming that you can’t even abide by your self invented methodology of using one attribute to show his uniqueness.

        4) I have asked you numerous times in the past to apply your ‘logic’ to each person. Apply it to the Father and by the very same ‘logic’ you’ll accuse him of being like an animal. But just like back then you’ll COMPLETELY ignore this and jump right back to the triune god instead of living up to the challenge of applying the same reasoning to each PERSON of the triune god instead of the triune god as a whole (not that the latter even works: see point 3).

        Liked by 1 person

      4. Joel

        fattest partpig

        You moron.

        1)You only seemed to “win” because PW deletes comments when you guys lose debates – entire comment sections have been deleted on his blog because he is too cowardly to face the falseness of his faith.

        2) What is your point idiot?

        3)

        Allah’s oneness is uncreated while ours is created.

        This is as stupid an answer as you have ever given – you have explained nothing. Man, you are so dumb. The “lah’s” uncreatedness has np bearing on his attribute of oneness. One cannot explain the other you sorry excuse for an apologist.

        The oneness comes from the ‘ONE being’ attribute,

        LOL!! Yes, the “lah” is one because he is one? Circular you illogical stone-kissing, pagan.

        4)

        I have asked you numerous times in the past to apply your ‘logic’ to each person.

        You are too stupid to even explain how stupid this comment of yours is. The three persons are one being – the concept of human and created oneness are different category. Fallacy:category error.

        So still, not a single one you orons can come close to explaining how the “lah’s” oneness is different to a goat’s without resorting to logical fallacy.

        LOL!!!

        Like

      5. “. The three persons are one being – the concept of human and created oneness are different category. Fallacy:category error.”

        thats like saying :

        steve, andrew and john are ONE HUMAN being . one speaker, one mover . one thinker .

        so tell us joel, did each persons consciousness FUSE with the triune beings consciousness making it 1 CONSCIOUSNESS? so how the f-ck is the triune beings ONE consciousness different than my one consciousness you s.o.b?

        do you see what happen ?

        now how is it when the 3 are EXITING AS one being , it is DIFFERENT than a testicle, goat, or sheep?

        ANY time you have a DISTINCTION, you are now saying that it is A being WITHIN “one being”

        so explain, how is it that your “one being” is DIFFERENT than a LEFT testicle of a goat?

        don’t think you are clever.

        fathher is god

        WHAT does “is god ” mean? it means it is A being. so how is the father BEING different than a goats testicle ?

        Like

      6. “I have asked you numerous times in the past to apply your ‘logic’ to each person.”

        You are too stupid to even explain how stupid this comment of yours is. The three persons are one being – the concept of human and created oneness are different category. Fallacy:category error.”

        “3 are 1 ”

        but no one understands what you mean by “are 1 ”

        does 1 (as in 1 goat, 1 sheep, 1 testicle) TRANSFORM the 3 ?

        for example :

        steve is tom
        andrew is tom
        john is tom

        not 3 toms , 1 tom

        is it “one ingredient ” ?

        is it 3 THINGS IN 1 thing ?

        Like

      7. how is its “EXTERNAL BEING” different than a goats “external being” ?

        just EXPLAIN the BEING, because the BEING is not the person. the PERSONS are LESSER than the being, right?

        and by the way, is a goats oneness greater than your gods “oneness” since it does not need to rely on other persons in order to work?

        you have 3 persons in trinity who need each other to form “one being”
        is a goats ONENESS GREATER because a GOAT CAN EXIST WITHOUT RELYING ON other goat persons ? ???????

        LOL!!!!!

        Like

      8. do answer about the oneness of the father

        a person loses his body and dies. he is still one person MINUS body. so how is the ONE PERSON different than the fathers ONE person ?

        Like

      9. Atlas Partridge

        “1)You only seemed to “win” because PW deletes comments when you guys lose debates – entire comment sections have been deleted on his blog because he is too cowardly to face the falseness of his faith.”

        Go back to the old posts and see for yourself. Those comments about this braindead topic you can’t seem to win (obviously) are still there. All the things you argue here are still there. Your appeal to PW is pathetic and a classic red herring.

        “2) What is your point idiot?”
        The point is idiot that you referred to your bible as bs.
        To call someone an idiot when you can’t even understand something so basic even after explaining it is just hilarious. Read it again.

        “This is as stupid an answer as you have ever given – you have explained nothing. Man, you are so dumb. The “lah’s” uncreatedness has np bearing on his attribute of oneness. One cannot explain the other you sorry excuse for an apologist.”

        Have you even read the comment? I said that you would argue back like this and you still argue back like this.
        I said that if you argue back by saying that you can’t explain the oneness of Allah being different from ours by going to another attribute (in this case the ‘uncreated nature’ attribute) then fine. I don’t really care. All I am asking is for you to do the same thing.
        You say your god is one. One what? One being. Him being one person or three doesn’t change him being ‘one being’. You can’t go to the multipersonality attribute to explain his ‘one being’ attribute being different than ours. It’s another attribute. But you’ll still do it. You’ll just say those two (the ‘one being’ attribute and the multipersonality attribute) can’t be separated and you’ll parrot your definition of your god and claim a hollow victory while at the same time denying us to use the uncreated nature attribute to distinguish Allah’s oneness from ours.
        This is what we have:
        Your god: one being Me: one being
        Your response: No he is not just one being, that one being consists of three persons (multipersonality attribute).

        You say: Allah’s oneness is same as mine
        My response: That oneness is uncreated.
        Your response: you can’t use the uncreatedness attribute to differ His oneness from me.
        My response: then why do you use the multipersonality to differ your god’s oneness from me?
        Your response: you @#|{@#, you still can’t answer me. Your imam blablabla…

        And this: “LOL!! Yes, the “lah” is one because he is one? Circular you illogical stone-kissing, pagan.”
        What are you talking about?

        “You are too stupid to even explain how stupid this comment of yours is. The three persons are one being – the concept of human and created oneness are different category. Fallacy:category error.”
        And there you go, you did it again for the millionth time. You run back to the triune god which you got wrong as well as I showed so many times. I wasn’t asking you about your triune god in point 4. Point 3 was about the triune god, point 4 is just about one person of the triune god.
        I was referring to just ONE person OF the triune godn not the triune god as a whole. You can ignore that as much as you want and funnily enough, you will.
        How does the oneness of the FATHER (NOT your triune god, JUST THE FATHER!) differ from our oneness? Do NOT give me your three person in one being bullshit. I’m not asking you that and you know it.
        How does the oneness of EACH PERSON OF the triune god differ from ours (again NOT asking how does the triune god’s oneness differ from ours).

        Liked by 1 person

      10. Joel

        fattest partypig

        Your appeal to PW is pathetic and a classic red herring.

        LOL!! So delusional. PW was so scared to face the problems with his religion that he deleted swathes of comments. Now you are just lying for allah.

        The point is idiot that you referred to your bible as bs.

        No I didn’t.

        You can’t go to the multipersonality attribute to explain his ‘one being’ attribute being different than ours. It’s another attribute.

        This is as clear proof as one can get that you are a complete idiot.
        Yahweh’s tri-personal attribute pertains solely to his oneness you fool – his essence of oneness is tri-personal. That is what makes his oneness unique. It is not an appeal to a different attribute – you made that dumb argument up because you are completely incapable of explaining how the “lah’s” oneness is different to a cow’s. Your argument is so dumb that there are no words in the language to describe how wrong-headed it is. LOL!!

        Stew has tried to argue – BY THE WAY, WHERE DID STEW RUN AWAY TO????!!!! – that the “lah” is one because he is unique. The problem is that every creature is unique, so your “god” is like creatures in that regard too. Worse still “uniqueness” as an attribute is separate from oneness – you simply cannot explain tawheed in a logical rational way without diverting to other attributes leaving the question of oneness completely unanswered.

        Like


      11. Yahweh’s tri-personal attribute pertains solely to his oneness you fool – his essence of oneness is tri-personal. That is what makes his oneness unique.”

        like the sperms in my testicles , its “essence of oneness” is in the millions.

        but the EXTERNAL being and the internal beings ARE clearly NOT “one”

        yhwh is not unique at all.

        Like

      12. ” his essence of oneness is tri-personal. That is what makes his oneness unique. ”

        like my left testicle . within it there is “essence of oneness” too.

        but that would be an INTERNAL thing .

        father is x, but NOT the triune X. the triune x is the complete package.

        father lacks PROPERTIES that the triune being has.

        for this reason, i ask u again, how is the triune being different than my left or right testicle ?

        for example, just read dale tuggys point here, your “triune being” is not unique at all it is a creation of a fucked up human mind

        http://trinities.org/blog/apologist-commits-to-actual-trinity-theory-faceplants-part-1/

        Like

      13. Atlas Partridge

        “Yahweh’s tri-personal attribute pertains solely to his oneness”
        In other words: the oneness attribute is inseparable from the oneness attribute because they are inseparable.
        Circular reasoning.
        And I didn’t say just ‘oneness’. I said ‘ONE BEING’ attribute. I am one being just like you non-existing god. Whether he is tri personal or not won’t change the fact we are both ONE BEING no matter how much you want to push the bullshit idea that tripersonality and one being attribute are not diff attributes. The fact is they are DIFFERENT attributes. If they weren’t they would be the same attribute but they are not. You even said this in the early talk we head on PW blog. And again your appeal to PW is pathetic!!! He has NOTHING to do with the conversation we had on this topic. Nothing.
        Revisit the blog and you can watch the comments you and we made, they are still there.
        Stop embarrassing yourself.
        I don’t care whether your god is multipersonal or not. He is one being and so am I. He is (allegedly) three persons while I’m one person so therein lies the difference, NOT in the ‘one being’ attribute. Your god exists as do I. Is he like me now? Stop being braindead and grow up.

        “The point is idiot that you referred to your bible as bs.
        No I didn’t.”
        O boy why do I even bother! You’re just 100% dishonest that you wont even admit something that is bare face naked right in front of your face.

        And like I ‘prophesied’ you didn’t engage with my final challenge that I’ve been putting up to you for ages.

        Liked by 1 person

      14. ““The point is idiot that you referred to your bible as bs.
        No I didn’t.”
        O boy why do I even bother! You’re just 100% dishonest that you wont even admit something that is bare face naked right in front of your face.”

        LOL!!! I also pointed out Coco’s slip-up. He refers to me as “q and bs” but since my username is quranandBIBLEblog, Coco’s hilarious parody actually calls the Bible “BS”! HAHAHAHAHA!!

        Like

  17. stewjo004

    @ Paulus
    What are you talking about? I may have linked to Discover the Truth at the most 4 times? And I think that was mainly on David(as) and Abishag just for speed purposes.

    As for your intended point, you were attempting to make that was just weird because all knowledge is based on previous discovery (hence sayings like “standing on the shoulders of giants”). But thanks for showing you didn’t read it because contradictions were just one part(even though some of our your top scholars such as C.K Barrett conceded they were contradictions ). I also used inconsistencies between the narratives and historical inaccuracies as a major backbone for the argument against the gospels being “inspired Word of God” or 100% reliable historical material. For example, robbers not being crucified according to Roman law with the citation for it.

    As I said when it comes to textual evidence you guys avoid like the plague because you can’t run off into “philosophical” tangents. If there’s something wrong in my article then please refute it with sources. If your refutation is convincing I’ll delete the relevant section or even the whole article if necessary because it’s about Truth. And as it stands now the truth is the gospel narratives are not reliable and the first pillar of the resurrection tale has fallen.

    Like

  18. stewjo004

    @ Qb

    Help Paulus out. Ask is 18 okay? Then 17, 16, 15, 14, etc until he stops.

    Also as a side notee I saw another issue with the sheer absurdity veiled in nonsense jargon. He is trying to say that you can’t quantify God within time and space yet he quantifies God with the number THREE. Can He be more than three or less? The Trinitarian theology says no. He will forever be three persons and never more or less.

    Liked by 1 person

  19. quote :
    “I AM” – that is, he is the god of the living, not of the dead. Try to think about it……..

    who is speaking joel ? is it the triune being speaking or one person who has oneness like a goat ?

    quote :
    17 When I saw him, I fell at His feet like a dead man. And he placed his right hand on me, saying, “Do not be afraid; I am the first and the last, and the living One; and I was DEAD, and behold, I am alive forevermore, and I have the keys of death and of Hades.

    “i am ” again joel….what is going on, WHO was speaking here? the triune being WAS “i am” and triune BEING WAS DEAD?

    whats going on joel?

    “i am” was a DEAD “i am” ?

    Like

  20. paulus

    quote :

    Bart August 5, 2018
    Life expectancy was low, in teh mid 20s, I believe, partly because of the large numbers of infancy deaths. Yes, tooth problems were often fatal — not so much regular decay as abscess. There was no way to control the infection.

    //////////////
    so paulus, how old would u married you pre-teen daughter off?

    9, 10, 11 or 12 ?

    Like

  21. “As far as Tony’s language, hey look, he’s a passionate guy. I don’t agree with it, and I do censor the bad language occasionally, but it’s not feasible to moderate every post. I do ask brother Tony to tone down the language.”

    yhwh = triune being

    each person is A being , not TRIUNE being .

    each person does not MERGE OR MINgle WITH triune being. that would be heresy

    my testicle = BEING /exists

    each sperm is A BEING/exists .

    i have found a match for the triune being.

    “3 in one” and “millions in one”

    i don’t know how any of this is bad language bro, i found match for triune being . yhwh does worse than me, he imagines israel as his naked bride.

    Liked by 1 person

      1. “Oh no, Coco is about to piss himself again!”

        the guy is a complete dumb fool . i mean think about it, a goat does not need other persons to exist as a goat, so logically a goats oneness is greater than the triune being , since triune being needs persons in order for it to work .

        Liked by 1 person

  22. ” The three persons are one being ”

    with such statement like this, 1 does not know what the hell this goat worshipper is saying .

    the father (who) is WHAT (not triune what )
    the son (who) is what (not triune what)
    and the ghost (who) is what (not triune what )

    his bs :
    the 3 persons (who’s) are one being (what)

    as we can see the persons and their what are PART of the triune being .

    it all goes back to what i am saying

    persons (sperm ) = being and testicle = being

    in other words the triune being is like my LEFT testicle.

    Like

  23. to make it easier , just look at the following

    Y = being (c) + persons (d)

    X is not C + D
    Z is not C+ D
    M is not C +D

    X, Z AND M ARE PART OF Y

    IN THE same way, the persons in my testicle are part of my testicle.

    but they EXISTING as persons and my testicle existing as testicle does not mean they are “one” they are PART of testicle.

    yhwhs “oneness” is like my testicle .

    Liked by 1 person

    1. i have offered a scientific method to analyse the trinity . in order to MAINtain the DIFFERENCES and keep them 3 ONE CAN NEVER MERGE/MIX/fuse them with one. that is the point and since EACH exists as a person and each PERSON is a being WHICH IS LESSER THAN triune being ,then the point is that i know the trinity BETTER than joel. the di%k head DOES NOT know the trinity.

      just admit it, yhwhs ONENESS is like my ONE testicle . why is it so hard for you to accept ?

      now comes the important bit

      SINCE one PERSON does not need OTHER persons to EXIST /work does that mean one person is GREATER than the triune being since they need each other to work ?

      Like

  24. stewjo004

    @ Paulus and Joel

    Also please stop using “lah” that is not a real word and makes you look ignorant of Semitic languages. What you’re trying to say is”illah”. However, “Allah” is NOT a contraction (despite common Muslim belief) of “Al” (The) and “Illah” (God) for several grammatical reasons.

    So you guys can understand better Jesus(as) never uses YHWH in any of the Gospels, he uses “Abba”, “Eloah” and “Elah” (which basically sounds like Allah just a change of a vowel). “Elah” is also used throughout the Hebrew Bible as well. So you can hear the pronunciation.

    https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?t=kjv&strongs=h426

    https://www.hebrew4christians.com/Names_of_G-d/Elah/elah.html

    So again you might want to cool it with the “lah” comments because you’re actually insulting God’s name.

    Liked by 1 person

  25. stewjo004

    @ Joel
    I haven’t run away anywhere. No one has even addressed me with a question. My life does not revolve around arguing on a blog. You’re not saying anything of substance and so there was no need for me to respond. You understand that God is calling you to worship Him alone and you reject this and choose to worship other things along with Him.

    God is one because you have no other god in the universe. It doesn’t need graphs, charts etc because it’s really not rocket science. There have been billions of animals, humans, angels, plants etc. but there is only and ever will be One God over us all.

    Liked by 1 person

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